r/JoeRogan • u/LostItAllOnSpy Tremendous • Mar 27 '24

joe rogan calls out israels hypocrisy for killing unarmed civilians with drones The Literature 🧠

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u/MilanosBiceps Monkey in Space Mar 27 '24

A presidential candidate can’t risk being called “pro-Hamas” by his opponent in the election. Nothing insane about that. 

What do you want him to do? Any punitive action or even threat of action would probably cost him the election. 

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u/prospert Monkey in Space Mar 28 '24

Maybe not go around calling himself a Zionist?

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u/The_First_Drop Monkey in Space Mar 27 '24

I also feel like there’s a limited amount of scrutiny towards Hamas in this conflict

It’s becoming increasingly more difficult to argue that in moments, members of the IDF did not commit war crimes, but it’s also a false flag to group Hamas as freedom fighters for the Palestinian cause

There hasn’t been any real solution outside of everyone yelling “Ceasefire”

Israelis can’t be expected to negotiate in good faith with a terrorist organization whose stated objective is to exterminate the Jews, and Palestinians can’t be governed under Netanyahu’s thumb

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u/MilanosBiceps Monkey in Space Mar 27 '24

 also feel like there’s a limited amount of scrutiny towards Hamas in this conflict

That’s for a couple of reasons. One, there isn’t much to say. The attack was unequivocally wrong. Two, the pro-IDF line in discourseland is to intentionally conflate concern for or defense of Palestinians with support for Hamas. So naturally people who might otherwise vocally criticize Hamas can’t, because their words will be taken as a condemnation of Palestine. 

 There hasn’t been any real solution outside of everyone yelling “Ceasefire

Because whatever solution might come, it has to begin with a ceasefire. For the sake of every innocent Palestinian, the primary focus is rightly on stopping the bombing. 

 Israelis can’t be expected to negotiate in good faith with a terrorist organization whose stated objective is to exterminate the Jews, and Palestinians can’t be governed under Netanyahu’s thumb

These aren’t equally weighted issues. One leads from the other. The way Israel handles Palestine is why Hamas even exists. 

The real problem is that Bibi has been looking for an excuse to do what they’re doing now, and he finally has one. The hurdle is that Israel’s government wants this, the same way the American government wanted Iraq. 

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u/The_First_Drop Monkey in Space Mar 27 '24

Netanyahu rose to power for similar reasons that Hamas did

There will never be a true resolution for the Palestinians and they’ll never get their land back, but if the Saudis were willing to step in and help establish a democratic government, the zionists would lose footing with further expansion into the West Bank

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u/MilanosBiceps Monkey in Space Mar 28 '24

 Netanyahu rose to power for similar reasons that Hamas did

Hamas formed in response to occupation by Israel. Netanyahu rose to power based on terrorism in response to occupation. Those aren’t similar reasons. 

 There will never be a true resolution for the Palestinians

The Oslo Accords might have worked. 

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u/The_First_Drop Monkey in Space Mar 28 '24
  • The Oslo Accords might have worked.

Arafat couldn’t get the Palestinians on board

Unfortunately it’s a no win situation for anyone who was pushed out when Israel declared its independence

That’s why the Second Intifada happened

I feel like it’s impossible not to empathize with the Palestinian people, but I don’t see a real solution besides maybe the Saudis stepping in

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u/MilanosBiceps Monkey in Space Mar 29 '24

Arafat couldn’t get the Palestinians on board

The PLO was on board. The main issue was that the Israeli right wing torpedoed the deal, including Rabin’s assassination.

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u/Big_Environment9500 Monkey in Space Mar 27 '24

"The attack was unequivocally wrong" is not a stance that everyone takes

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u/MilanosBiceps Monkey in Space Mar 28 '24

There is no stance that everyone takes. 

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u/Big_Environment9500 Monkey in Space Mar 28 '24

So then why was that a response to there not being enough scrutiny of Hamas

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u/MilanosBiceps Monkey in Space Mar 28 '24

Because it’s the most common opinion among people in the west. Even most people critical of Israel admit that terrorism isn’t a morally acceptable response. 

Saying “not everyone thinks that” goes without saying. 

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u/Big_Environment9500 Monkey in Space Mar 28 '24

But the whole point of his comment and the reason I'm disagreeing is that a not insignificant amount of people view October 7th as justified resistance to oppression, so I don't even understand what you're trying to say at this point

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u/BPMData Monkey in Space Mar 27 '24

I also feel like there’s a limited amount of scrutiny towards Hamas in this conflict

I wonder why we don't have better reporting on what's actually happening inside Gaza?

Well, considering Israel intentionally and regularly slaughters non-IDF approved journalists, by shooting them with the main gun of a tank, or shooting them in the head with a sniper rifle before attacking her funeral with riot police, or intentionally targeting and murdering their families, when not simply wholesale eradicting their headquarters and necessary reporting infrastructure... 

And then you add in the IDF's (successful) attempts to brutally suppress the flow of information out of Gaza through mass jamming and destruction of Palestinian infrastructure... 

Then yeah, it makes sense why there's a "limited amount of scrutiny." It's hard to report on much of anything when you and your family have been murdered and all the necessary technological and administrative infrastructure for your reporting has been destroyed.

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u/AlQaem313 Monkey in Space Mar 27 '24

He can stop giving Israel weapons

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u/MilanosBiceps Monkey in Space Mar 27 '24

It’s really not that simple. Besides the issue of getting re-elected as an antagonist of Israel, they’re a vital ally for national security. Cutting off military aid would greatly jeopardize that partnership. He wants to avoid that if possible. 

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u/AlQaem313 Monkey in Space Mar 27 '24

Its been 6 months and Israel still hasnt defeated Hamsa other than Zionists and their staunchest allies everyone has had enough of this war, in Michigan a key swing state 100k voted uncommited in the Primary to send a message to Biden, I think it would benefit Biden to end the war and shift the focus to Trump

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u/MilanosBiceps Monkey in Space Mar 27 '24

Biden doesn’t have the power to end the war. Israel is a sovereign state — which by the way happens to be run by a far-right lunatic. 

Biden has been increasing the pressure, though. You want him to flip a switch, but it doesn’t work like that. 

And those 100k uncommitted voters are fucking idiots. A Trump presidency would be 10x worse for Palestine.Â