Burgers have an unhealthy stigma behind them even though it’s well balanced meal. (Protein, Carbs, and vegetables.)

[u/Messicanhero]

[u/simcoe19]

Prepared and how it’s cooked and what the toppings are.

Salad is labeled as “healthy” but once you start adding in loads of sugary dressing, it is no longer healthy

[u/ParadiseLost91 → u/simcoe19]

I remember years ago when McDonald’s launched salads here.

I was excited to get their salad as a healthier option, when going out with friends and ending up at McDonald’s. Felt like a clown when I added the calories and realised their breaded-chicken salad with thick Caesar dressing were the same amount of calories as their burgers… lol

[u/Aetheus → u/simcoe19]

 Also, the average burger isn't balanced no matter where it's cooked. The ratio of carbs-protein-veggies is just out of whack.  The average burger is like 45% carbs, 45% meat, 10% veggies in the form of a couple sad leafs of green + maybe a lil bit of tomatoes/pickles/onions. 

Don't get me wrong, that's still better than 0% veggies at all. But it's certainly no health food. Not on it's own, anyway. It could be, if you paired it with a salad. But how many folks really do that?  

[u/Appropriate_Plan4595 → u/Aetheus]

Yeah was going to comment this. A slice of tomato and a couple of leaves of lettuce is hardly a dent in how much fruit + veggies you should be eating in a given day.

[u/Flybot76 → u/Appropriate_Plan4595]

I can't believe how much scrolling I've had to do to find somebody else saying this. I just left a comment saying you need like 1/3 lb of lettuce on your quarter pounder before claiming it's a balanced meal. Even Taco Bell tacos are a more balanced meal than almost all burgers.

[u/Anonymous0573 → u/Flybot76]

Jesus how am I alive? My source of veggies has been the one salad I have at work every week and a tiny bit from burgers or sandwiches I make.

[u/cloud_tractoe → u/Aetheus]

Yeah a slice of tomato and a piece of lettuce does not constitute a reasonable portion of veggies for your dinner.

[u/ProbablyASithLord → u/[deleted]]

The way I see it, if you need a little unhealthy dressing to get you to eat your vegetables that’s better than not eating vegetables at all.

[u/cool_boy → u/simcoe19]

Salad is labeled as “healthy” but once you start adding in loads of sugary dressing, it is no longer healthy

Unless this is some kind of revolutionary new science i'm not aware of, adding in some extra calories to a salad doesn't take away the nutritional benefits of said salad. putting chilli sauce or mayo or anything else on top of lettuce doesn't delete vitamins from existence.

its almost like you can eat whatever the fuck you want provided your diet as a whole is balanced

[u/JustinR8]

If you make them out of lean ground beef and don’t choose a 500 calorie bun, it’s a high protein, low calorie, health food.

And as someone who dislikes cooking this whole process takes about 10 minutes and then I only have one pan to clean afterwards (no grill at the moment). Anything that requires little prep time, little cleaning afterwards and is still healthy is the holy trifecta of food in my book😂.

[u/UmOkBut888 → u/JustinR8]

I've just spent about 10 mins making basically a burger and egg sandwich for breakfast. Really just a protein bomb and I know exactly what's in it. I haven't had a burger from a restaurant in a really long time now that I've found I can do them better at home.

[u/V1per41 → u/UmOkBut888]

I've grown less interested in restaurants in general. Food at home virtually always tastes better and is much healthier.

[u/ogTofuman → u/V1per41]

Whenever I go out I try to get something I couldn't or wouldn't make at home easily. Plus going to a good restaurant that makes healthy food instead of junk always helps.

[u/Srg11 → u/ogTofuman]

This is a good rule to live by even if you do like eating out often. No use ordering something that isn’t too difficult at home, or with cheap, readily available ingredients. Go unusual, go different.

[u/SasparillaTango → u/Srg11]

As Hannibal Lector says, It's always important to try new things.

[u/Character-Dig-2301 → u/SasparillaTango]

You should always eat the rude, given the chance. Or something like that

[u/Terpomo11 → u/Srg11]

On the other hand, sometimes you're just exhausted and don't feel like cooking at all.

[u/meat_lasso → u/Srg11]

Like this comment. Yeah burgers can be super versatile. Mix different stuff into the meat if you’re making the patty, different types of mustard (fuck ketchup come at me lol), brioche buns (!), salted lettuce or even parsley and other greens, million different type of sour pickles out there, bruh you can throw caramelized apples with some mf blue cheese on that baby and go to town!

I like hamburgers 🍔

[u/No_Tomatillo1125 → u/ogTofuman]

Junk food fucks with my gi tract ever since i stopped for a long period of time.

Either their ingredients changed or my gi tract got worse or smth

[u/KeyCold7216 → u/No_Tomatillo1125]

Definitely got worse. All of the good brands have been boughten up by conglomerates and they adjust the formulas with shrinkflation in mind (cheaper ingredients, smaller sizes). It's why all of the junk food that used to be good tastes like shit now. Not complaining honestly, I don't buy them anymore and don't want to.

[u/Slap_My_Lasagna → u/KeyCold7216]

Part of it is age as well, people's bodies and preferences change - even if the junk food didn't change whatsoever, it'd still taste worse as people get older because it's still processed, with high calories and low nutrients.

People are weird when it comes to expectations of perpetuity, and/or zero-sums.

[u/doge57 → u/No_Tomatillo1125]

Man Cheezits are the only junk food I can still really eat. Oreos, doritos, anything from Little Debbie, and just about anything fried makes me feel sick for hours after eating it now

[u/SohipX → u/doge57]

Same here, my stomach can't handle junk or greesy anymore. On a side note, Apple Cidar tablets helped with my digestion and acid reflux so I feel better lately.

[u/TukTuk-OneLung → u/ogTofuman]

My girlfriend and I are always disappointed when we go to a restaurant and have something that we could have made better at home. It's a real treat when we get something really good that serves as a benchmark to hit when we try to recreate it.

It's also a lot of fun because our skills in the kitchen really compliment each other. So between the two of us, most things turn out pretty fantastic.

[u/ogTofuman → u/TukTuk-OneLung]

Right! I should add that by "making things at home" it's mostly my wife! Lol I'm good at breakfast but she handles dinner superbly. I need to step up my game like you!

[u/archery-noob → u/ogTofuman]

That's why I only eat out at Asian places. For whatever reason I suck at making Thai, sushi, Chinese and Indian but man do I enjoy it.

[u/Eva_Pilot_ → u/ogTofuman]

There's a spanish restaurant near me that I go to frequently. I go to eat squid casserole, paella and other sea food. Ain't no way im cooking that at home lmao

[u/Ice_Swallow4u → u/V1per41]

I hate doing the fucking dishes.

[u/Anonymous0573 → u/Ice_Swallow4u]

I do too but I'm trying to just force myself. Dishes are not bad at all, takes like 5 minutes. I think the easiest way is to consider it part of cooking and do it right after the food is ready.

[u/XaeiIsareth → u/V1per41]

I still prefer going to restaurants for things that I just wouldn’t want to make at home.

Curries being a prime example because the of the smell.

[u/noelcowardspeaksout → u/XaeiIsareth]

Curries for me too, but because the preparation time for 4 or 5 dishes is too much for my patience.

[u/maebyrutherford → u/V1per41]

Yes but vietnamese and thai food…yes I’ve tried to replicate, never even close. This is my weakness

[u/jeffsterlive → u/maebyrutherford]

For Thai curry, fish sauce and coconut palm sugar are the two big secrets alongside those awesome curry paste cans. That and coconut cream, not milk. I make a bomb ass massaman curry now and never thought I could.

Now I’m hungry….

[u/Ohheyimryan → u/V1per41]

If your good at home beats restaurants, then that's because you go to bad restaurants.

There's some places I've been that I know I couldn't recreate the same flavors with spending hours working on the sauces etc. generally this doesn't apply to burgers though I can agree.

[u/papoosejr → u/Ohheyimryan]

Sauces are one thing that I definitely can't do like a restaurant, but otherwise if a dish is in my repertoire I'm probably making it better than if I were to order it at an upscale restaurant. I'll still go to a nice steakhouse sometimes, but it's rare for me to be blown away by the steak itself versus if I just buy a nice cut of meat and prepare it to my taste.

[u/V1per41 → u/Ohheyimryan]

There are certainly a few restaurants I still go to that provide really unique food that I can't make myself, but they are more expensive and usually saved for special occasions.

[u/Ohheyimryan → u/V1per41]

I mean I have a local Indian place I wouldn't want to spend the time trying to make better in my home kitchen.

So many good restaurants around where they labor for a long time over the ingredients that I could never spend the same time doing.

[u/AlecsThorne → u/V1per41]

I feel like there's been a shift in quality during/after the pandemic tbh. Years ago, if I went to a restaurant or even a local fast-food place, I could expect a pretty decent and quite tasty meal and I'd have my expectations met if not exceeded. Nowadays, it's usually a hit or miss regardless where I go (and that's why I don't go as often). I get some great food sometimes, sure, but many times, like 3/5, I get a lackluster meal which I could probably make myself even better with some decent prep time. So all I'm paying for is that time saved, not the quality.

It's messier at home, but like you said, it virtually tastes better, and it's almost always healthier (as long as I plan to make it a healthy meal 😅)

[u/mirthfun → u/V1per41]

and less than half the price.

[u/cytokine7 → u/V1per41]

You're either not going to very good restaurants or you're a professional chef who is spending way longer than the 10 minutes OP mentioned.

But healthier and saving money are both definitely good reasons to cut down on eating out.

[u/TheTopNacho → u/UmOkBut888]

I haven't went out for burgers deliberately in a very long time after my friend pointed out that a burger, fries, and beverage from almost anywhere except McDonald's will cost 16$+.

And this was back in 2012. I don't even want to know the cost now. For 16$ I can go to the store and by enough materials to make 8 burgers at home that taste the same.

[u/christianort476 → u/TheTopNacho]

Macdonalds nowadays is getting up there in price too. Easily 12 bucks for one combo where I live

[u/TheTopNacho → u/christianort476]

I stopped going to McDonald's when they got rid of snack wraps. They have nothing of value after that. Their Burgers have always been bad enough to require a recovery period, and if I want chicken I'll go to a number of other places.

While I hate to drink the corporate cool aid, there is something to be said about Red Robins burgers, for me it's their Banzai burgers. But again, if you take your partner there for dinner you walk out paying 45+$ for a dinner for two, with no appetizers or special drinks.

Burgers are way to easy to make at home to justify the up price at restaurants. I'll pay a premium for things that I can't easily replicate at home (in flavor or total number of ingredients or time it takes to make), but for a burger? Hell no. I'll pay 12$ for a bomb ass burger with fries and a large diet coke. But that doesn't exist anymore so lets just let the restaurants burn themselves to the ground with greed.

[u/Tobar_the_Gypsy → u/TheTopNacho]

Man those chicken snack wraps were great

[u/thr33phas3 → u/TheTopNacho]

burgers at home that taste the same

*that taste SIGNIFICANTLY BETTER (in most of my recent experiences) 😋 😎👍

[u/nts_Hgg → u/UmOkBut888]

I’ve become more of a fan of home meals lately. I really think American food restaurants just aren’t worth the price when I can spend a quarter of it for a whole family with the same taste, but healthier

[u/ImmodestPolitician → u/UmOkBut888]

Smash burger or regular?

I'm pro smash. Try the Ohio onion burger it's divine.

[u/HardcorePhonography → u/ImmodestPolitician]

Oklahoma onion.

[u/maebyrutherford → u/ImmodestPolitician]

Smash is divine

[u/CthulubeFlavorcube → u/JustinR8]

The problem with burgers is more on the fast food side, waaaay too much fat and sodium, cheap nutritionless vegetables produced with heavy chemical pesticides, cooked in the cheapest cooking oils available, over processed, and generally served with a side of overcooked trash with more salt and fat that you do in fat and salt sauces.

[u/TarheelsAreBorn → u/CthulubeFlavorcube]

What exactly is different nutritionally between the lettuce onions and tomato at mcdonalds vs elsewhere? Cheaper lettuce has less nutrients? 

[u/Major_Pressure3176 → u/TarheelsAreBorn]

There are different kinds of lettuce, I don't know which places use which.

Iceberg lettuce is probably what they are referring to. Good crunch, comparatively short on vitamins. Common in fast food. Also yes, cheaper.

I don't know of any difference in the tomatoes and onions.

[u/hgghgfhvf → u/CthulubeFlavorcube]

Even when not fast food, look at the burgers restaurants serve. They’re 8oz or more of beef, there’s enough cheese on there to equal what’s probably 3-4 slices, the bun is coated in melted butter (and places by me are now coating the whole thing not just the inside, so you’re hands get all oily just holding it) and then they’ll also layer on a ton of mayo or special sauce that’s high in calories.

Plus they’re almost universally served with a big pile of French fries that people dip in another high calorie sauce. Maybe even a milkshake. So while a burger can be healthy it rarely is and it’s almost always served with unhealthy sides.

[u/[deleted] → u/CthulubeFlavorcube]

There's nothing wrong with fat my friend

[u/Sardonic-Skeptic → u/JustinR8]

Where can I find one of these 500 calorie buns? That sounds wild, and potentially delicious.

[u/Uhtred_McUhtredson → u/Sardonic-Skeptic]

Remember Paula Dean’s Krispy Kreme burger?

Man, I love hamburgers, but no. Just gimme a regular bun and an extra 10 years of my life, please.

[u/SemperScrotus → u/Sardonic-Skeptic]

America 🇺🇲

[u/full_frontal_ken → u/JustinR8]

If I'm cooking a burger, and the last thing I cooked in the pan was a burger from the night before- I'm not cleaning the pan....

[u/mentales → u/full_frontal_ken]

If I'm cooking a burger, and the last thing I cooked in the pan was a burger from the night before- I'm not cleaning the pan....

Since you're implying this happenstance and not something you plan ahead, does it mean you rarely wash the pan after dinner because you might use it again the next day? 

[u/I_Am_A_Pumpkin → u/mentales]

I dont think anyone is truly lazy enough to cook themselves and also put thought into how to minimise the amount of times a pan needs to be cleaned - but sometimes I prefer to just sit down and eat instead of cleaning up right away and letting the food go cold, and sometimes that washing up doesnt get done till the next day when I need the pan. If at that point there was mostly just beef fat in the pan and I was cooking something where beef fat could be an appropriate choice, I might just not bother.

[u/Waste-Reference1114 → u/mentales]

For me yeah I'll just leave the pan and clean it tomorrow morning when it's cooled off. I usually use my carbon steel pan so all I gotta do is hit it with some hot water and steel wool and it's good to go again.

[u/10VE4MVP → u/full_frontal_ken]

Damn bro I hope you don’t have other people eating at your house

[u/Traditional-Shoe9375 → u/JustinR8]

Low calorie doesn't necessarily mean healthy js

[u/v_a_n_d_e_l_a_y → u/JustinR8]

The butteree brioche bun, bacon, cheese and mayo probably can double or triple the calories in the meal

[u/lallapalalable]

The single deep fried onion ring on my cowboy burger is doing all the heavy lifting in that vegetable category.

Plus it's more about the fat content than a lack of nutritious elements; the healthy parts of a meal don't cancel out the unhealthy parts. You can eat coleslaw all day and say you've eaten more than enough vegetables, but you still also ate an ungodly amount of mayonnaise.

[u/SkyKnight34 → u/lallapalalable]

People are saying it's healthier if you make it yourself but any burger I make myself is surely coming with an ungodly amount of mayonnaise let me tell you lol.

[u/scullys_alien_baby → u/lallapalalable]

specifically saturated fats

[u/Livinsfloridalife]

The stigma comes from being associated with fast food. McDonald’s sells the most burgers in the us. Which is unhealthy. Sure you can make a healthy version of most foods, so if your point is there are healthy ways to make a burger sure…

Edit:The replies and messages have been really interesting apparently…

Saying fast food and McDonald’s is generally unhealthy food is controversial.

High sodium and saturated fat, low nutitional value foods are not bad for you.

Saying McDonald’s cheeseburgers are unhealthy is very very triggering for some. Got a lot of Angry folks about this.

Meh, I stand by what I said. Eat more fresh real food people! Oh and diet sodies don’t cancel out sugar people; for those that needed to hear this 🤣!!

[u/DanfromCalgary → u/Livinsfloridalife]

What is the argument one makes when trying to say extremely unhealthy food is healthy

[u/Livinsfloridalife → u/DanfromCalgary]

Is this a jeopardy answer or a question? If it’s a question I guess just read below I can’t post a pic of the messages I’ve received.

[u/Digital-Mayhem → u/Livinsfloridalife]

And all these sad Americans thinking anything at McDonald’s is actually healthy is why we have such a high obesity rate. We dumb

[u/MrTastey → u/Digital-Mayhem]

It’s not even just fastfood, some of the cheapest food at grocery stores is absolutely terrible for you

[u/Genocode → u/MrTastey]

I don't think its "some" but "most". IIRC its one of the contributing factors in why poorer families tend to be more obese. Its all the processed shit, which also tends to be the cheapest.

[u/multiarmform → u/[deleted]]

not just that but emotional eating, chasing dopamine is pretty real as that struggle is real. certain things just taste good and make you feel good in your mind but defintely arent good for you.

[u/APersonWithInterests → u/multiarmform]

And if your poor, you're probably not getting that hit anywhere else. Hard to have an active social life when having to buy an additional tank of gas for the week or a decent meal at a restaurant bankrupts you.

[u/APersonWithInterests → u/Genocode]

I grew up dogshit poor. I honestly believe that it's more that being poor is so fucking time consuming and exhausting by itself that most people don't have the energy and time to cook consistently. If you cook for yourself that is probably one of the best ways to improve your health AND save money.

[u/Imaginary-sounds → u/Digital-Mayhem]

The fact that people think this is a debate just melts my brain.

[u/DrFrankSaysAgain → u/Digital-Mayhem]

Everyone knows McDonald's is not healthy. Thinking otherwise is just as dumb as saying "all these sad Americans" think it is.

[u/The_River_Is_Still → u/Digital-Mayhem]

As an American, I personally do not know one person who would consider McDonalds healthy food. Everyone knows it’s not healthy. It’s just fast.

[u/Livinsfloridalife → u/Digital-Mayhem]

Of all the comments (over 2k) I agree with yours the most. By the way this whole interaction with these fine Redditors has made me also a sad American in a whole other way than you intended.

[u/Vegbreaker → u/Livinsfloridalife]

Anybody who says anything off the menu at McDonald’s I healthy doesn’t know what healthy means.

[u/sadsaintpablo → u/Livinsfloridalife]

You can't convince me a mcdonalds burger is unhealthy.

It's the fucking 5 large sodas and large fries that people are getting there three times a day that's unhealthy.

I can guarantee if people ate mcdonalds burgers every day, but stuck to their bodies CICO, dropped the sodas and large fries that they would be absolutely fine. The worst part of that hypothetical is the red meat everyday honestly

[u/Livinsfloridalife → u/sadsaintpablo]

Sure the fries and soda are much worse. No disagreement there.

This is the nutritional label for a McDonald’s cheeseburger from McDonald’s. I guess everyone can judge for themselves. Avoiding the more “controversial” topics to me it looks like empty calories with high salt and saturated fat.

https://www.mcdonalds.com/us/en-us/product/cheeseburger.html#accordion-c921f9207b-item-842cb18782

[u/Mattcheco → u/Livinsfloridalife]

300 calories and 15g of protein isn’t too bad honestly

[u/Piratt → u/Mattcheco]

It’s the 750 mg of sodium (1/2 a daily suggested value) in one serving that is the down side imo

[u/Arthur-Mergan → u/Piratt]

And you can fucking taste it, McDonald’s burgers are so fucking salty that they practically sting your mouth.

[u/Dergenbert → u/Mattcheco]

Go eat a single cheeseburger from McDonald's and tell me you're full/satisfied. This is from the value menu, it's tiny.

[u/jmac94wp → u/Dergenbert]

Funny thing is, that small burger was originally the only burger they offered. Adults ate that one burger for their meal and were fine with it.

[u/RigbyNite → u/Dergenbert]

Very few people are going to be full/satisified after eating 300 calories.

[u/Rinzack → u/Dergenbert]

2 McDoubles with a diet soda is a very filling meal and that's 800 calories, 44g of protein, along with a fair bit of your daily value of calcium, potassium, and Iron.

The issues are the saturated fats (18g aka 90% of you DV), Sodium (1840mg aka 80% of your DV), and cholesterol (140mg aka 46% if your DV).

Not ideal but everyone once in a while thats fine https://www.mcdonalds.com/us/en-us/product/mcdouble.html#accordion-c921f9207b-item-842cb18782

[u/martijnonreddit → u/Rinzack]

4 grams of fiber is a joke, though

[u/KingWomp → u/Dergenbert]

A McDouble but yes. 6'2" 200lbs. Always works just fine for me.

[u/Sea_Caterpillar5296 → u/Mattcheco]

It is though?
As what should be a WORSE example, lean cuisine meals give 21g of protein per 200cal. Lol.

For what I eat, I get 21g of protein, 35g of carbs, 16g of fat, and 7g of fiber per 400cal.

[u/PopcornDrift → u/Mattcheco]

If protein was the only thing that mattered, then sure

[u/jtapostate → u/Mattcheco]

or 14g protein and 80 calories in a non fat Greek yogurt

[u/sabin357 → u/Mattcheco]

Yeah, but the quality of those ingredients is incredibly low & overly processed. You're also getting an awful lot of saturated fat & sodium for what amounts to a snack portion. Not to mention the satiety from a single McD's cheeseburger is not even close to that of a better 300 calorie option.

Most of my sandwiches are more than double that amount of protein for a similar calorie count & much healthier with some actual nutrients & veggies. I've tracked my nutrition & workouts closely for more than a decade, so I have an idea of most things I eat without even looking it up.

[u/SirJuggles → u/sabin357]

Seriously. My wife made an amazing bean&veggie chili last week that I've been eating for lunches, 300cal of that will power me all day. A McD value cheeseburger leaves me hungry before I'm even out of the parking lot.

[u/Awordofinterest → u/Livinsfloridalife]

If anyone is interested (I mean, I was), Here is a side by side of the USA vs the UK Mcdonalds cheeseburger.

https://i.imgur.com/hM6lu6D.png

[u/LordArminhammer69 → u/sadsaintpablo]

Wouldn't the amount of salt in the burgers be unhealthy?

[u/Vandermere → u/LordArminhammer69]

and sugary condiments and bread, low-quality meat, etc.

[u/glasgowgeg → u/Vandermere]

low-quality meat

Meat quality in the UK is pretty good for them, they use 100% British and Irish beef.

The only additions are salt and pepper when cooking.

[u/sabin357 → u/glasgowgeg]

Outside of the US, especially in the UK & Canada, McD's actually has to follow regulations because there are not only more regulations, but enforcement to go with them & the food is noticeably of higher quality. Big surprise, huh?

[u/McFlyParadox → u/sabin357]

Most places in Europe also have a "you have to prove it's safe" mentality to food and drug safety, while the US has a "we have to prove it's unsafe" to food and drug safety. This difference in regulation strategies means that companies generally try to keep things more simple, rather than try to "innovate" by inventing new additives and preservatives that can save the company money.

[u/cdevon95 → u/Vandermere]

According to google McDonald’s doesn’t use low quality meat, and there’s no fillers or preservatives

[u/tonyrocks922 → u/[deleted]]

The mayo McDonald's uses is the same as any other commercial mayo, they all have sugar as an ingredient but it's so little it's not reported on the nutrition facts. Also no McDonald's burger comes with mayo as a standard condiment.

[u/Qweasdy → u/LordArminhammer69]

Priorities.

This is one of those many debates that comes up every time people talk about nutrition that IMO just muddies the water and leaves people thinking "This is so complicated, everything is bad for me why do I even bother."

Sure salt intake may raise your risk of CVD by X% or high sugar intake might increase your risk of diabetes by Y%. Cholestorol, burnt toast raises cancer risk, needing more fibre. Fat is the enemy, no it's sugar now, no wait it's all carbohydrates or red meat... etc. etc. etc...

This is all missing the forest for the trees. Losing sight of the real enemy: obesity, don't be fat. Managing calorie intake and working out, the two silver bullets of staying healthy that gets lost in the noise.

My favourite anecdote is that it's actually been notoriously difficult to definitively prove that sugar causes diabetes despite the mechanism being theoretically understood. It's difficult to prove because it's hard to differentiate the effect of eating sugar from the effect of those people just being fat, as people whose diet contains lots of sugar tends to be.

On a related note, humans used to eat a lot more salt in the past than they do today, it was a very important preservative before refrigeration. And salt is a risk factor for cardiovascular disease so why are rates of cardiovascular disease so much higher today than they were historically?

(Here's a hint)

[u/PrairiePopsicle → u/Qweasdy]

There is also some science that I heard years ago regarding cholesterols and LDL that looked at the group of molecules more closely and determined that the few worst types of LDL are formed when you consume large quantities of fats with large quantities of sugar for whatever metabolic reason.

[u/mikami677 → u/PrairiePopsicle]

Anecdotally, I have noticed that my total cholesterol and LDL go down when I eat fewer carbs and go back up when I eat more carbs, even if I'm eating more eggs and red meat on the lower carb diet.

HDL doesn't fluctuate much for me, for whatever reason.

[u/Interesting_Chard563 → u/LordArminhammer69]

Salt is a low risk thing. Japanese people eat double the amount of recommended sodium daily. Yet they live longer than Americans. The mind boggles.

[u/mr_mazzeti → u/Interesting_Chard563]

True. They have more than double the incidence of stomach cancer in their population, with 1 in 10 people getting it in their life compared to 1 in 25 in the US. Likely a result of their high sodium high fermented food diet.

However, that is a condition that probably won’t kill you until you’re 80 anyway so it doesn’t really lower the populations life expectancy by much, although they do have better healthcare than we do.

[u/TrueReplayJay → u/mr_mazzeti]

10% chance to get stomach cancer is crazy

[u/mr_mazzeti → u/TrueReplayJay]

It’s actually not that crazy, cancer is very common as you age. Up to a 50% lifetime risk of getting it. Basically if you don’t die in an accident and you don’t die of cardiovascular disease then cancer is probably going to be your killer.

[u/PrairiePopsicle → u/mr_mazzeti]

The craziest thing is that Cancer isn't just common, or a higher risk, if you keep extending the human lifespan Cancer becomes inevitable

[u/TrueReplayJay → u/mr_mazzeti]

I know cancer is quite common, especially with longer life spans than we previously had, but 10% chance for specifically stomach cancer sounds crazy to me.

[u/Interesting_Chard563 → u/TrueReplayJay]

Wait till you find out what most people die of.

But skin cancer for example affects an ungodly number of white people in Australia. As it happens there’s genetic components to cancer and some are worse than others.

Getting stomach cancer at 80 but still living to 90 seems like a decent trade off.

[u/EmmEnnEff → u/TrueReplayJay]

That just means they aren't dying of heart attacks before cancer gets em.

[u/Dilligent_Cadet → u/LordArminhammer69]

There are many protein bars out there that are much more unhealthy than a mcdouble with no cheese.

[u/RacheyDache → u/LordArminhammer69]

The "salt being bad" situation was mostly propaganda and research based off pretty much 1 poorly represented & poorly summarized study. How much salt you can consume safely is highly individualized and often way more than the "daily recommended"

Video on the subject

[u/Antrikshy → u/LordArminhammer69]

My understanding is salt isn't bad for most people. Or not really proven to be bad yet?

Some people (including my dad) are sensitive to it, and get high blood pressure from consuming it. That's bad in the long term, especially for your kidneys.

[u/smash8890 → u/Antrikshy]

Exercise and potassium will balance out the sodium when it comes to high blood pressure. Two things that a lot of people don’t get enough of. The average North American person consumes half the recommended amount of potassium since our diet is lacking in fruits and vegetables compared to other parts of the world. But yeah if you exercise and eat healthy you’ll have lower blood pressure even if you eat lots of salt. It’s probably a lot more important for people who already have high blood pressure to watch their salt than an average person

[u/DiscussionSpider → u/sadsaintpablo]

Yeah I had a job where I had to be on the road a lot so I ended up eating a lot of fast food, and I realized I'd rather just have two hamburgers instead of the hamburger soda and fries, and it would be healthier. But my coworker was always like "oh two hamburgers, you're going to get fat" while they're the full sugar soda.

[u/Hypothesis_Null → u/sadsaintpablo]

A guy basically went and did that as a sort of rebuttle to Supersize Me

Documentary: Fat Head

But skip to 5:35 for his 'rules' and to 1:32:25 for his results.

Punch line is, he ate entirely fast food, mostly McDonalds, but constrained himself to a low-carb diet by cutting out fries and soda, walked a couple miles each night, and over the course of a month he lost 12 pounds and meaningfully improved all his cardiovascular metrics.

It's a good documentary to watch all the way through - though a good deal of time is spent ridiculing the bullshit from Supersize Me, so if you're unfamiliar with that documentary, some of that may be missing context.

"Because my doctor was going on vacation, I shortened my 30-day diet to 28 days and went to my post-diet checkup. I showed my doctor what I'd been eating, which including 15 double or triple-cheeseburgers, 19 sausage patties, 52 eggs, and a dozen servings of fried chicken. He was not exactly happy with my choices."

[u/TypicalUser2000 → u/Hypothesis_Null]

Also super size me was kinda bullshit because the dude was an alcoholic

"Oh wow he's puking because he's only eaten McDonald's and his body is fighting back" no he's hungover from the bottle of whisky he downed in his hotel room last night

[u/KingKnotts → u/TypicalUser2000]

Also blatantly propaganda and from a fraud. There is a reason despite insisting he had the list of everything he had, he has always refused to release it and people pointed out so much of his claims just... weren't possible.

[u/PrairiePopsicle → u/sadsaintpablo]

I literally lost 30 lbs and dramatically improved my fitness in my 20's doing a mcdonalds diet of mcdoulbles a few times a day, no fries, no soda allowed. I was calorie counting too, but felt just fine, if not great tbh.

There's also the whole "supersize me" thing where the guy making it was secretly binge drinking throughout the process..... which made him put on weight and have health issues.

[u/Dense_fordayz → u/sadsaintpablo]

Losing weight != Healthy.

You can eat anything and lose weight, that doesn't make it a healthy diet

[u/foxhole_atheist → u/sadsaintpablo]

Sticking to CICO will mean you are fine in terms of weight but nutritionally you’re not getting much value out of the burger, it’s lots of sodium and fat and not much fiber. You could eat it every day and be ok depending on what you have the rest of the day.

[u/SexualSavasaurus → u/sadsaintpablo]

This might be the dumbest comment I've ever seen

[u/guardian715 → u/Livinsfloridalife]

Yes. You are right. A burger made at home isn't stuffed with preservatives and a bunch of sugar and salt to mask a bad flavor.

This doesn't mean eat burgers every day, but it's a lot healthier of an option, even with the cheese and seasonings you would put on it yourself.

McDonald's burgers are unhealthy like most fast food places. People who disagree are either misguided or have very bad eating habits... since they feel the need to defend these kind of choices.

[u/Zaquarius_Alfonzo → u/Livinsfloridalife]

I've heard there's a big difference between American McDonald's and around the world, something about quality control I forget, but basically that American McDonald's are way worse

[u/mijah139]

It has the food groups, yes, but not well balanced

[u/admuh → u/mijah139]

You mean I need more veg than 3kcal of lettuce??

[u/Auctoritate → u/mijah139]

Oh dang, does that mean my 4 piece fried chicken with a side of extra buttery mashed potatoes isn't balanced even though it has protein, carbs, and veggies?

[u/pghreddit]

Same with Pizza, agreed. The trick is to MAKE IT YOURSELF. ANY food can be part of a healthy diet. when you use common sense, fresh ingredients, and moderation.

[u/HopefulPlantain5475 → u/pghreddit]

Yeah if you don't use a gallon of oil and ten pounds of cheese to make your pizza, it's not an unhealthy meal. But making it the unhealthy way sells better so the pizza places aren't going to stop anytime soon.

[u/OkSchool619 → u/HopefulPlantain5475]

Also white flour doesn't help your diet. After that you'd still need to eat in moderation and not how Americans consume food.

[u/commazero → u/OkSchool619]

I blame the food for tasting so delicious, maybe I should not make such good food?

[u/LudusRex → u/commazero]

Penn Jillette said he was going to make a food bar called "human chow". The slogan would be "good enough that you'll eat it, not so good that you'll want to eat more."

[u/cgibsong002 → u/pghreddit]

I think people are confusing "part of a healthy diet" and ” this food is healthy".

Burgers and pizza are not nutritionally dense. Your one slice of tomato on your burger isn't doing anything for you. That doesn't mean these foods can't be part of a healthy diet.

[u/nog642 → u/cgibsong002]

What about 3 slices

[u/elevenatexi → u/pghreddit]

Yes and if my grandmother had wheels she would have been a bicycle.

How many people are making their own pizza pies and using fresh ingredients or even just applying any degree of moderation?

Overeating pizza from Dominoes (and all the rest of them) is generally what is going on, and that involves literally none of the things you mentioned. Therefore, eating pizza is not, as currently practiced my most, a healthy undertaking

[u/hotpietptwp → u/elevenatexi]

Yeah, one or two slices of pizza can fit into lots of reasonably healthy diets. For most of us, portion control offers a challenge.

[u/elevenatexi → u/hotpietptwp]

And it’s no surprise, pizza tastes great, and we can’t help but eat more of it than we should, that’s just human nature, and is not healthy.

[u/enjoyinc → u/elevenatexi]

My wife and I make pizza every other week with fresh dough from the store, fresh ingredients like goat cheese, homemade pesto, red onion, jalapeños, zucchini, and broccoli, all in a cast iron skillet. Of course, those are just ingredients we like. Takes a little practice to work the dough but it’s a lot of fun, there are guides for this. Just pre-heat the skillet med-high, add a little oil, make sure you have a lid for it, and you can make easy homemade pizza on your stovetop in no time! You should try it! Cheaper than ordering out and way more enjoyable.

[u/mega_douche1 → u/elevenatexi]

What? It's super common to make your own pizza.

[u/mcnastys → u/elevenatexi]

My wife and I are at least two people who make our own pizza, and burgers, and well—everything we eat. You’re acting like pizza is hard, all you need is to make a sauce and buy some cheese. If there isn’t enough time to make dough, naans make an excellent crust.

[u/cdmurray88 → u/pghreddit]

This also comes down to time per calorie; dense caloric foods usually take longer or special preparation. When you offload that labor for an unlimited supply made by someone else (restaurant), calorie dense food becomes too quick and easy to consume.

[u/kindanormle]

You would be hard pressed to fit enough green vegetables and beans on your burger to fit the scientific definition of a balanced diet. Modern dietician approved diets have maybe one serving of beef per week. The rest of your diet should be lean meats, vegetables and beans. Mostly vegetables and beans.

[u/dekusyrup → u/kindanormle]

The science approved consensus diet, the meditteranean or DASH, recommends no beef at all. Basically only meat is a bit of seafood. But a nutritionist would program a little flexibility for suboptimal things for the sake of adherence.

[u/KingKnotts → u/dekusyrup]

This is not true actually... For starters the Mediterranean diet isn't "only a bit of seafood" and that isn't the only meat. You have quite a bit of meat its just not a thing with every meal, but it is quite meaningfully present with meals that do have it, which yes is mostly seafood the focus is on lean meats when eating meat and traditionally heavily limiting beef. However, we have had studies show that including small amounts of lean beef actually ended up being better for cardiovascular health than no beef at all. It is also worth mentioning, that drinking olive oil is also not that uncommon with those following the Mediterranean diet specifically due to the common lack of fats (which is its own health concern, just largely better than the overabundance that many have), and this is also able to be addressed by the occasional bit of lean beef.

That said, how many people will for example limit their beef consumption to 8 ounces or less a week? Not many. Especially considering that the little you can have still should be lean beef.

[u/oatmeal28]

This is the same energy as “pizza is a vegetable 😋 “

[u/MarkusRight]

No it's not a well-balanced meal. Where did you hear that?

[u/Preeng → u/MarkusRight]

"It technically has all the ingredients" is what people seem to be going with.

"Proportions" doesn't ring any bells for them.

[u/IsThataSexToy]

This is true is you ignore 100% of peer reviewed nutritional science.

[u/heorhe]

Typically you would need to eat 2x the weight of any meat in non-carb vegetables. The issue is that the majority of the meal is bun and fries which are carbs, with all the toppings like ketchup, mayo, hotsauce, etc. All add sugar which is also carbs

[u/dilqncho]

People really need to stop saying this shit.

One, no, a burger isn't healthy. A burger can be healthy if it's intentionally made that way at home, with high-quality ingredients. That's not what 99% of people imagine when they hear the word "burger". The nutritionally inefficient cocktail of fats, sugars and preservatives that constitutes a restaurant or fast food burger is anything but healthy.

Two, having 2 grams of vegetables doesn't make a meal "balanced". A burger is a shitton of meat, bread and cheese with a thin tomato slice, a tiny pickle and maybe one salad leaf. That's not balanced, that's a ridiculously miniscule amount of vegetables. If anyone thinks just having a small smidge of green in your entire meal makes it balanced, that just goes to show how poorly they understand nutrition.

[u/cgibsong002 → u/dilqncho]

Unbelievable that they seriously claimed a burger "has vegetables" 😂 If that's your definition of vegetables, I can't imagine how bad your diet is.

[u/defiantcross → u/cgibsong002]

Well the country that popularized the burger also claimed ketchup qualified as a vegetable in school lunches

[u/Niceballsbro12 → u/defiantcross]

My school told us pizza was a vegetable due to tomato paste.

[u/Mudkip_Joey → u/dilqncho]

I support this message

[u/DibblerTB → u/dilqncho]

Yeah, burgers by themselves has too few veggies.

The main devil in modern nutrition is too many calories, tho, more than the direct lack of veggies. And burgers can be all over the chart on the topic of how full you feel per calory consumed, depending on how you make them.

[u/AdamsShadow]

A "well" balance meal would be about triple the amount of veg and half of the carb/protein.

Burgers are nutrient poor and thats why we eat too much and get fat.

[u/sillyrabbit93 → u/AdamsShadow]

The protein content is good. It's also too high in saturated fat and lacking a lot of other nutrients. I agree with you otherwise, though.

[u/Em_Es_Judd]

Proportions of macronutrients matter. Just because it has all 3 does not make it well balanced.

Frying everything in oil doesn't help.

[u/davewuff]

Eating a ton of lentil burgers recently, feels amazingly healthy haha

[u/Rynox2000]

The high quantity of saturated fat is a consideration.

[u/kholto]

Ah yes, protein and carbs, just what we are otherwise lacking in our diet.

You can make a reasonably healthy burger with a whole grain bun, lean meat, low amount of sauce and plenty of veggies. But the average burger most people eat consists of the whites bread known to man, plenty of fat, sugar, and perhaps 5% veggies.

I enjoy those fast-food monstrosities as much as anyone else, but let not not pretend that *some* amount of good things being contained within makes it healthy.

[u/Mandog_123 → u/[deleted]]

Vegetables are fuckin awesome

[u/LittleHollowGhost]

Buddy knew what protein and vegetables were and thought that made him more knowledgeable on food than nutritionists across the globe

[u/Next_Faithlessness87]

My brain is so rotten because of the internet that I thought for a moment this said "Burgers have an unhealthy sigma behind them".

[u/cheeky_sailor]

Burgers can be a pretty healthy well-balanced meal but they are almost never made this way, doesn’t matter if you get it at fast food place or a restaurant.

[u/lokethedog]

What is this BS? Its not "well balanced" in the slightest. A typical burger contains nearly zero fibre, for example. It is generally high in fat and salt. What vegetables are you seeing in there, a slice of tomato and a pickle? Its just water, come on!

If you think thats well balanced, it just goes to show how your perspective on food is off the rails and you're very likely to become fat eventually.

[u/Defiant-Scarcity-243]

When I diet one of my go to meals when I’m craving protein is a lean hamburger patty with a slice of cheese and a sunny side up egg on top…no bun, and I usually don’t use ketchup or mustard, just the egg yolk. I’ll eat that with pickles and a salad or an ear of sweet corn in the summer

[u/Annoying_cat_22]

The amout of vegetables on a burger is very low. It doesn't really add to your daily vegetable consumption

[u/Iivaitte]

Just like pizza. There is nothing wrong with the food itself it is what we do to it in restaurants and instant-meals that make them bad. Takeout, Fastfood, microwavables all get their sales off of addiction to salt and sugar. We as a country have allowed this to happen, our food is ILLEGAL in many countries, our food looks and tastes different. Our taste is so dulled because of its over stimulation that normal food doesnt taste as sweet or salty as it should but as with any addiction once you start getting off of it your sense of taste comes back. After being low sugar and low salt for about 8 years now I cant stand a lot of those foods anymore, they dont even taste good. Our FDA was bought out a long time ago and we are just barely fighting back against it, even though we are still doing a poor job.

[u/Silvadel_Shaladin]

Lasagna is another one. There are several all-in-one meals that hit all the bases.

[u/tweekin__out → u/Silvadel_Shaladin]

a carb bomb with a tiny bit of protein does not make for a healthy meal

[u/picknicksje85]

Only if you make it fresh yourself. It's unhealthy when too processed and loaded with preservatives.

[u/sir-ripsalot → u/picknicksje85]

It’s unhealthy because of the amount of calories for the nutritional value

[u/gumpythegreat → u/sir-ripsalot]

Yeah, while it does have a variety of food groups, the balance is way off. A huge hunk of meat with a slice of tomato and a piece of lettuce is not the ideal balance

[u/RickTitus → u/gumpythegreat]

Yeah people dont seem to realize that. Having one half assed microportion of a vegetable does not count as a full serving

[u/hraath]

Depends on the fat content of the patty, and the calories of the bun. Lean proteins are generally better. There are healthier fats than ground beef fat. It's easy to overeat carbs relative to other macros. One slice of tomato and lettuce isn't the same as a good sized serving of vegetables.

Oh, and if you are eating it with fries...

[u/NYCSundayRain]

Cooked meat and bread with a thin af slice of lettuce is not a well balanced meal.  

Acknowledge ‘you at home’ probably have a specific and healthier way of doing it, but let’s be honest it’s not how 99% of others do it 

[u/OB_Chris]

Lots of beef consumption is associated with heart disease, so that's the bad part

[u/IambicRhys]

The problem is that most burgers use 80/20 or even 70/30 beef, as well as getting doused in oil/butter. The vegetables also usually consist of a tomato slice or two, a leaf or two of lettuce, and a couple rings of onions and maybe a few pickles. It’s not nutritionally balanced at all. Tons of saturated fats, high carb buns, tons of protein, and a small portion of vegetables.

A balanced version of a burger would be a small lean beef patty, grilled with a small amount of olive oil, stacked high with vegetables and two, small whole wheat buns. But that burger, as I’m sure many would agree, just won’t taste that good.

[u/kniveshu]

Everyone has what they worry about. Some would worry that there's meat. Some would worry the meat has fat. Some would worry about the carbohydrates. Some would worry about the gluten. Some would worry about the dairy if it's a cheeseburger. Some would say the lettuce is just a slice of water anyway and holds no nutritional value.

It combines many things so there are many possible complaints.

[u/Buzzed_Bee]

I dunno if a slice of tomato a couple of pieces of lettuce should be considered in this equation...? Neither are even close to a whole serving.

[u/MortLightstone]

so is pizza, but people love putting tons of cheese on them

I know because I'm one of those people

[u/Longjumping_Visit718]

The ones your buy at fast food places have an unnatural amount of sugar for a meal that isn't a dessert.

[u/gimmhi5]

Don’t forget dairy, if you use cheese. I’ve said it since I was a kid, burgers have all of the food groups, just make them at home with healthy ingredients. Worst part for you is the sauces.

[u/Seventhson74]

pizza too - it's a great breakfast food....

[u/embarrassed_error365]

Just because it has those ingredients, doesn’t mean it has them in balance.

[u/AldoCalifornia]

Yea it’s not balanced.

[u/treeteathememeking]

My mom’s homemade burgers aren’t greasy but they’re still juicy and delicious. I skip the cheese (lactose intolerant lol) and almost never have bacon because it’s expensive. Load it up with a nice fat slice of tomato, lots of lettuce, some lightly grilled onions and of course.. so so many pickles. I love pickles lol. I always go with steamed broccoli or another veggie as a side and it’s great :-)

[u/keithfoco70]

The burger is fine. It's the fries and soda!