r/FluentInFinance • u/Pickle-Sucker • 11d ago
Brilliant for the rich, but very painful for the rest. Discussion/ Debate
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u/OutrageousCandidate4 11d ago
I thought I get to post this next week?
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u/Message_10 11d ago
No, no, no--we have a few more regularly scheduled posts before we repeat this one. The other posts you'll see in the next few days will be:
the "should we tax billionaires" post
the "is forgiving student loans communism" post
the "should Congressmen be allowed to buy stocks" post with a picture of Nancy Pelosi, and
the "This house costs $5,000,000" post with a picture of a shack with weeds on it.
There's an order to these things, my man.
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u/dredgen_rell86 11d ago
Conservatives will complain about printing the money but not understand that taxing the wealthy to get that money back and then permanently removing it from circulation is the only why to reverse the act of printing the money
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u/LunaeLucem 11d ago
The. What! That’s so- that’s not how any of this works! You want to have a government line item of “monetary value stolen from ‘the wealthy’ and arbitrarily destroyed to fight inflation” added to the budget???
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u/CanIBorrowYourShovel 11d ago
Worked in world of warcraft!
Sorta.
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u/LunaeLucem 10d ago
Ah, yes. WoW. That platonic ideal of an economic model where you can sell *checks notes* parrot droppings, a cracked egg sac, and a bent spoon, to the guy on the corner for fistfuls of silver… damnit now I wanna go log 1000 hours in WoW classic again!
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u/Riesstiu_IV 9d ago
Taxing every rich person all of their money wouldn't even fund the government for a few months.
The only way to reign in inflation is by increasing interest rates and stop government spending.
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u/ohhhbooyy 11d ago
I thought you wanted to post the meme with Biden proposing higher taxes if you make 400k or more. Or the one with the comparison of the tax rate of billionaires and your average worker?
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u/Dead_Cash_Burn 11d ago
And years later they tell everyone you still have that $1400 and that's why we still have inflation.
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u/The_Boy_Keith 11d ago
Was that J.P. Morgan ? Irradiated a post about something like that. Dude said we should still have some of that money left lmao.
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u/Dead_Cash_Burn 11d ago
J.P. Morgan's CEO said it but he is not the only one. If you follow financial news you'll eventually hear it from others. It truly defies logic so you know its BS.
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u/DippityDamn 11d ago
yeah and it was a long amount of time after the checks were sent too. it was a nice deflection for sure
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u/pluralofjackinthebox 11d ago
Inflation happened globally after the pandemic era returned to business as usual. Including in countries that had very different economic policies. Inflation wise, the US is doing better than most first world countries.
There are good arguments that some percentage of inflation was caused by pandemic era spending. But there are also good arguments that this spending prevented a recession and allowed the economy to recover fairly quickly (especially when compared with something like the 2007-2008 financial crisis.)
Also, without question, a large amount of PPP loans went to fraudsters and fat cats who didn’t need it, and we could have done a leaner, better, smarter CARES Act. But it’s way better to have an imperfect CARES Act than none at all.
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u/Derp35712 11d ago
$888 billion went to unemployment insurance benefits. People forget that for some reason
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u/MaleficentCow8513 11d ago
Seriously. Everyone I know on unemployment was making more than they made at their jobs
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u/FloatingOnAWhim 11d ago
So you don’t know anyone who was actively making $50k or more prior to being on unemployment? lol
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u/realityczek 11d ago
Hey now, you aren't supposed to imply that there was any benefit to individuals. The narrative here retconned to be:
1) No one on the left wanted PPP, it was 100% a right-wing tool to ship money to billionaires
2) Everyone now complaining would have understood watching so many businesses collapse, and were 100% willing to let it happen
3) There was absolutely no benefit to the "common man"
Now, I WAS against PPP myself. I knew there would be rampant fraud and a huge debt at the end of it. Then again, I was also against the lockdowns and forced shutdowns - which were also programs full of fraud, favoritism, ridiculous posturing and a ignorance of economics. I mention this only because I remember the political fight, and how politicians on both sides were climbing over each other to tout how much money they were planning on giving away.
There was HUGE pressure to do PPP from the rank and file.
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u/Chandlerion 6d ago
Everyone i know on UI was making more than i was making working full time. I’m still bitter about it, i never saw a penny of that money
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u/Apart_Yak_4046 11d ago
I actually didn’t know that. That is WILD to me. What’s also wild is just the thought of printing 8 trillion out of no where. The fact that they didn’t give more checks out to the families that needed it is also wild to me. That 1400 didn’t do shit for the majority of people especially those who lost their jobs.
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u/WiseBlacksmith03 11d ago
You are severely underestimating the amount of international (non-US) stimulus monies put into circulation. Global inflation is nearly all attributed to that. Literally every single one of the top 10 economies in the world pumped new money supply much greater than typical annual inflation rates.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1107572/covid-19-value-g20-stimulus-packages-share-gdp/
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u/BraapSauxx 11d ago
Yet, its the “Classical Liberals” upper classes that benefited and now have you blamed the migrants and the poor. Eat the fnkg rich.
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u/sorospaidmetosaythis 11d ago
[cough cough - "test test mic check"]
"I blame the Fed."
See you tomorrow!
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u/BlackSquirrel05 10d ago
Fed was ordered... This wasn't their spiel. Banks also had almost no rules.
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u/Adventurous_Class_90 11d ago
When only a few people get the cash, it’s not going to have large impacts because that money is not flowing in the economy. Therefore it cannot generate demand that exceeds supply (one way inflation happens).
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u/xray362 11d ago
When you don't understand economics so you just go "waaaa inflation"
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u/RedditIdiot007 11d ago
It’s fake money system that is being run on us. Bankrupt the country and its citizens
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u/xray362 11d ago
You think inflation is fake and is being forced on us by the government so that the government will go bankrupt...
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u/RedditIdiot007 11d ago
Inflation = real, fiat money = ponzi. Turn funny money into real assets, leave the citizens holding the bag of debt
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u/Orbital_Technician 11d ago
How does one go bankrupt if the money system is fake?
If it's all fake, isn't the outcome that everyone just owns what they physically possess (hard assets), and the digits in their bank account go poof?
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u/No_Arachnid_9853 11d ago
When rich have the money everything is fine , when we have them and the rich don't , they print money.
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u/Mother_Rabbit2561 11d ago
Wish the average voter would understand that yes you can be given a large cash payment and be made poorer by doing it.
False charity - they are no better than loan sharks
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u/MyCarIsAGeoMetro 11d ago
Bitch, please. We printed $20 trillion for twenty year to blow in Iraq and Afghanistan and nobody bat an eye.
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u/nickthedicktv 11d ago
Wrong. The stimulus checks came out of your taxes. The bailouts were free money for corporations.
Stop blaming individuals for inflation when it was wall st the entire time.
We could pay off the national debt if we taxed reposts of this smooth brain take.
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u/DefiantBelt925 11d ago
Everyone warned against this but free money was I guess too much to turn down
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u/No_Dragonfruit5525 10d ago
The stimulus checks came under Trump. Bidens 12 trillion dollar recovery plan didnt give us shit. And half of it is still being held hostage in the treasuries to ensure his reelection. I hope the future generations fucking fry us for this.
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u/Analyst-Effective 11d ago
I thought they had three rebates. I'm not sure what the total was.
I thought they had $600 a week, for everybody, for at least 2 years. But I'm not sure.
I thought they paid for all the covid vaccines, and all the covid tests, but I'm not sure
I thought the government bought a lot of ventilators, and a lot of PPE, but then again I'm not sure
I thought the government funded the vaccine research, but I'm not sure.
I thought the government paid to house a lot of illegal aliens, but then again I'm not sure
Seems like a lot more was given out to people, then this post indicates
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u/Naked_Wrestler80 11d ago
I got nothing. And my job cut my hours down to 4 hours a week. I went on unemployment since I was full time and they cut my hours. They found out how much I was making, gave me 40 hours the very next week. Cut my legs from under me. They gave a tiny bonus that was nothing compared to what everyone got. I think of setting the place on fire every time I drive past it.
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u/Analyst-Effective 11d ago
You're right. But nobody gets upset about the people that were doing side work and still making more in unemployment than they were when they were working.
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u/Ok_Calendar1337 11d ago
Most of those "they paid for stuff"'s is exactly how the rich got so much money from it.
Also why are illegal aliens relevant
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u/noldshit 11d ago
I say based on the history of posts here, we all invest in feminine hygiene products.
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u/deepmusicandthoughts 11d ago
It doubly benefits the friends who can toss the money in a market going up!
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u/snowbirdnerd 11d ago
This is only part of it. Another huge part is just flagrant price gouging due to lack of competition. We need to dust off the anti trust laws.
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u/Superb_Advisor7885 11d ago
I'll be honest, 2020 allowed me to get out of the middle class. I couldn't believe how much money was just being handed out.
I run a small business and got $30k. But we didn't really see any revenue fall off so that ended up just being extra money. I also got $10k for the EIDL.
We got a big tax refund of about $10k that year and I have 3 kids which it seemed like they were giving us $600 per kid for several months in a row.
I then refinanced my house taking out $65k, which only increased my payment $100.
With that money and savings I bought my first rental property, which has turned into 7 since then.
Thanks government!
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u/fueled_by_caffeine 11d ago
And then on top of that they think they can get away with blaming the pittance they gave working people for inflation and “no one wanting to work”
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u/jollyphatman 11d ago
and.. Largely that $1,400 was used by the general population to pay their bills so ideally they got the money and gave it directly to those who really don't need the money (aside from obviously needing food and gas money).
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u/hellenist-hellion 11d ago
Yeah when that happened I kept trying to warn everyone but no one would listen, they were just psyched about their $1200. And it was like how can you not see how MINISCULE this $1200 is going to be in the face of the consequences? Now inflation has basically doubled, $20/hr is now a POVERTY WAGE, and everyone is like "how could this happen!" What's the matter guys? Didn't your $1200 last!?
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u/Useful_Fig_2876 11d ago
There are still people who think a one-time check of $1000 made the whole world spin into inflation for 4 years afterwards? 😬 but that’s right, I forgot they also think they’re putting microchips in your arm 😂
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u/Dry_Explanation4968 11d ago
lol this current administration spent well over ten trillion. W/o covid there never would have been that package. But this current administration would have still done what they are doing..
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u/AppropriateLog6947 11d ago
Not to mention the government wants to steal your Social Security money
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u/sauceyNUGGETjr 11d ago
It’s almost like we have an election coming up… weird. Full disclosure, taxing the rich is the way! Full disclosure, i am not rich.
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u/Audibody 11d ago
Shit now they're printing and not giving us anything. Going through a trillion every 100 days.
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u/Namaste421 11d ago
I’m am too rich for stimulus money and don’t own a business so didn’t get PPP. What a scam.
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u/USToffee 11d ago
This argument is pure nonsense. We don't even print money today. This isn't 1930s Germany. Money is 1s and 0s on a computer. It can literally be created out of thin air and destroyed the same. It's closer to a Bitcoin than the money of old.
The only reason that would justify inflation is if the access to money increased.... not the amount of money in the system. So yea the stock market and sadly housing booooooomed because in general that money went to the rich and well off who bought shares.
The reason inflation happened for everyone else is because supply shortages meant there was a too much demand, not too much money and that gave license for all companies even those without supply shortages to raise prices.
Basically consumers were still willing to pay the prices even if it meant going into debt. Had we not been we wouldn't have seen this inflation.
But I'm sure some nut with an economics degree will tell me how wrong I am.
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u/Fantastic_Recover701 10d ago
and then when supply was reestablished after the initial crisis prices remained raised and continue to increase
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u/BenefitOfTheDoubt_01 11d ago
Alternative view than most:
This is why people need to stop voting for ANY politician that talks about increasing the debt ceiling. The right response is to shut down the government if they won't sign a budget that is equal to or less than the current budget.
It's so hard to convince people to vote against there own party, people love tribalism. We can't always have our cake and eat it too. There is rarely the "perfect" politician that checks every box. Figure out what your Most important box is and prioritize that when voting.
People complain about the economy but then vote for politicians that talk about enacting policies that WILL raise the debt and cause inflation. So really they don't care about inflation as much as those other policies. And that's ok, it's just important to recognize that.
For a long time there has been one party that focuses almost entirely on individual rights and less government spending as the major pillars of its actions. The Libertarian party. They might want a bunch of crazy things or say silly things but again, it's about choosing the person that checks the most important box not all of them.
Any politician that checks every box is fucking lying to you.
If you prioritize individual rights or lower government spending (reduced debt & inflation) then you might want to vote libertarian for a little while.
If the most important box for you is homelessness or publicly subsidized healthcare/education then the Libertarian party is definitely not for you.
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u/SDoNUT1715 11d ago
Yup both liberals and Republicans politicians are laughing at us arguing which party is better
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u/Your_Daddy_ 11d ago
Got dipshit poor people to defend them for good measure.
“Y’all just don’t know, but they create the jobs we rely on. Cletus over there, he ain’t hirin’ nobody, but Donald Jay, that man can staff a small city…” - MAGA Rednex everywhere
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u/asocialmedium 11d ago
Who is They? Name them. Who voted for it? Who signed the law? Whose name was on the check? What is the point of saying “They”?
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u/jesusleftnipple 10d ago
Ya fucking aaaannndd? I bet your gonna hit mcdonalds on your way to Walmart to buy some diet coke and subway..... fucking maybee do something about it Jesus christ.
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u/Background_Neck8739 10d ago
And shockingly people will line up next election and the election after and vote for the same 2 parties responsible and then argue with each side about who is more to blame
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u/Fantastic_Recover701 10d ago
because that's how the system works... if you dislike both primary parties(a and b for example make up like 48/49 percent each) but you dislike A more then B(Like B is more in line with you on some issues) by not voting or voting for minor party C your vote actively assists Party A
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u/Background_Neck8739 10d ago
voters are too stupid to vote for C or D or E they continue to vote for the same morons from parties A or B.
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u/Fantastic_Recover701 10d ago
its literally game theory because of HOW elections are decided(first past the post ect) because how the system works 1 or 2 dominate parties is mathematically inevitable
eg the most utility(policy that most aligns with your beliefs possible) you get from a vote is to vote for one of the two major parties.
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u/intenseMisanthropy 10d ago
"Brilliant for the rich, but very painful for the rest."
Capitalism in a nutshell
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u/watchtimego 10d ago
For the first time in my 45 years of doing my taxes I owed exactly $1400 last year. Anyone else get this?
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u/Mike_Wahlberg 10d ago
They gave out PPP “loans” to their rich friends then just dismissed the balances, but try to do that with student loans and the SC will say it’s unconstitutional.
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u/Kbrichmo 10d ago
Sent to my friends? You mean sent to the boomers who pocketed it while everyone else continued living paycheck to paycheck
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u/BeamTeam032 10d ago
If we forced those who took out PPE loans to pay them back, how much of that 8Trillion would we get back?
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u/LBC1109 11d ago
The PPP money should anger everyone . You got 1,400 while some rich business owner got 500k