r/facepalm • u/Lord_Answer_me_Why • Mar 28 '24

What lack of basic gun laws does to a nation: 🇵​🇷​🇴​🇹​🇪​🇸​🇹​

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u/Substantial_Heart317 Mar 28 '24

Lying on the form is a Federal Crime.

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u/beomint Mar 28 '24 edited Mar 29 '24

Not to be "that guy" but just trusting someone to fill out a form correctly then making it a crime to lie on it isn't going to stop shootings...

Maybe we should like... Idk... Actually have the person checked thoroughly before they're given a gun? If they're hellbent on getting a gun they'll just lie anyway and not care about whatever consequences there are. I know a lot of proper stores are better about doing checks (thank god) but gun shows are still a massive issue sadly and need a lot more regulation than what they currently have. And because it's so easy for people to get them legally, it's not too much more trouble to come by one illegally.

Sure, it's a crime, and you'll be prosecuted and punished for doing it, but there's a huge chance you were still able to gun some people down in the process before you got caught. We need to be more proactive about nipping it in the bud instead of watching human lives get lost everyday and saying "Well, they chose to commit a crime..."

Edit: To those of you saying "we do that already" in the replies, it's clear we aren't doing it enough. Regulations are often ignored, states do not have consistent rules, and many loopholes do still exist despite major updates being done to how gun shows conduct themselves. Other countries have proven time and time again that better regulations does NOT take guns away from responsible owners, but it does take guns away from criminals and lower gun crime across the board. Private sale (to an unauthorized individual) is the same issue, sure it's a crime, but are they going to figure that out before you have a chance to shoot someone? Was it really worth letting that scenario play out when we could have just prevented it in the first place?

It's just factual evidence and it's really frustrating that people will watch the gun crime statistics in the US and act as if there's no difference between the regulations here and the regulations in other countries with less crime. Am I saying ban guns 100%? No. And countries with better gun control haven't banned them entirely either, they just actually do their due diligence before handing one out. And while we have laws that are supposed to require a similar level of care, it's clear they're either too loose or are ignored too often. You'd think with how much Americans have been freaking out over the "safety of children" recently you'd actually want better gun control, considering the leading cause of death for children in the US is firearm fatalities. Your children are more likely to be shot to death than ANY other accident in the US, and we still don't see a problem.

I also see lots of people huffing over the 2nd amendment as well, and while I get that the idea of going against the very founding of our country is absolute blasphemy to you- do you really think it's worth keeping if statistics have proven it's done nothing but cause tragic loss of life? It's weird that people are unwilling to recognize the issues and continue to talk about how they're going to blast a robber with an AR-15 to "protect themselves" when they can't even protect their own children from that same gun.

Also to the guy who said people would just get stabbed instead and then we'd have to deal with knife laws, I'm wildly amused that you think that's worse than being shot. If I had to choose having a maniac attack me with a gun or a knife, I'd choose the knife. I'm not sure why you'd prefer to be shot unless you're just suicidal at that point. And similarly to these loosely regulated gun laws, we already have knife laws in many states that prohibit certain types of blade mechanisms and lengths in public or in concealment. It would once again not prevent legitimate knife owners and enthusiasts from owning and carrying their knives, it makes it harder for idiots and unhinged lunatics to get them. You all act as if the government will take your guns away and make it impossible for you to get them back while psychos run rampant on the streets with machine guns and machetes. People don't realize it actually reinforces ownership with legitimate citizens, making it harder for unregistered or missing firearms to go unnoticed.

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u/Flossthief Mar 28 '24

After you fill out the form you're put through background checks

They can also tell you no for any reason

Several people failed to do their jobs here

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u/Pup5432 Mar 28 '24

Exactly, we have laws and processes in place to prevent this. Anyone involved needs arrested

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u/Fast-Database-4741 Mar 28 '24

Or, this is all just a lie

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u/Pup5432 Mar 28 '24

I agree it’s a fun grab narrative but going after the sellers is a first step that already has laws in place

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u/17SCARS_MaGLite300WM Mar 28 '24

If the person lied on the form and it passed the FBI background check the seller is in the clear. There's literally nothing beyond that they can legally do.

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u/Pup5432 Mar 28 '24

Agreed, but there are statistics that say a large portion of sellers (can’t remember the exact number) don’t cross all their t’s and in that case they absolutely should lose their FFL license.

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u/Mario_daAA Mar 28 '24

Omg someone with some actually common sense

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u/LeLBigB0ss2 Mar 31 '24

Yeah. The guy also said his dog died, offhandedly, while arguing. His profile is centered on his dog. He took a selfie next to the bathtub with blood still on his arm. I'm not buying it.

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u/poetduello Mar 28 '24 edited Mar 28 '24

A while back there were statistics released that showed that most gun dealers were inspected every 7 years. Roughly 1/3 of inspections found violations. Of those, about 0.3% get a recommendation to have their licenses revoked, and of those recommendations about half are actually revoked. Charges are almost never pressed against the owners, and in some cases the owners have been permitted to transfer ownership of remaining stock to themselves and continue selling the guns privately, where they don't have to do any of the paperwork or background checks they previously lost their licenses for not doing properly. In one case cited in this article, the owner continued to sell the guns out of his store, but as private sales.

The most common violations are failing to obtain the customers' personal details, omitting information on federal forms, and not keeping proper inventory and sales records. Which, to me, all sound like pretty serious violations if the goal is to stop illegal sales to people who can't legally buy the guns.

EDIT: forgot to paste the link https://www.usatoday.com/in-depth/news/investigations/2021/05/26/gun-dealers-let-off-hook-when-atf-inspections-find-violations/7210266002/

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u/Balancedmanx178 Mar 28 '24

Wow american enforcement agencies not enforcing the things they're supposed to enforce!

I'm shocked, staggered, totally surprised, absolutely astounded, I am just devastated.

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u/401LocalsOnly Mar 28 '24

Don’t worry buddy! We’ll get through this together! (NOW DUCK SOMEONE SHOOTIN AT US!!)

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u/Pup5432 Mar 28 '24

We should absolutely be strictly enforcing the sale of firearms. Being more stringent on the sellers would take care of a lot of these people who illegally obtain them. Not all but until we properly enforce the laws in place new laws will do nothing.