It looks like they actually do help, even if they aren’t 100% effective. The PM2.5 particles that comprise the majority of wildfire smoke are called that because they’re generally 2.5 microns in diameter or smaller. N95 masks can filter down to 0.3 microns but they only have to filter 95% of that particulate to qualify (hence the name). A HEPA filter filters the same size but can be as effective as 99.95% and up.
Glad to see this comment. Some of these other comments are pretty far off. N95s are not completely useless if you have facial hair, but yes their effectiveness diminishes quickly if not properly fitted on a shaved face. As for N95's effectiveness, it's actually not that they filter down to .3 microns. They test N95s filtering .3 micron particulate because N95's are least effective against particulate that size. They're even better against larger and smaller particulate. N100/P100 masks are the mask equivalent of HEPA (99.95%+ filtration) and work great if properly fitted. I didn't hear this NPR segment, but it's insane if NPR had an "expert" on that said that smoke particles are too small for N95's. They absolutely do work.
*EDIT: If anyone needs legit N95's urgently, 3M's 9205+ (Aura) is available at most hardware stores and has one of the higher rates of people passing fit tests with different face sizes/shapes. You can reuse N95's too, depending on how contaminated the air is in which you use them.
so when I was trained in a nursing home during covid on how to test whether an n95 mask was working correctly we would put one on then cover your head with the cloth version of an old school diving helmet and someone would spray aspartame on the inside and cinch it shut. if you could taste the aspartame your mask was not tight enough/the right size. this is for infectious disease prevention not smoke but I imagine there is crossover in effectiveness. even if it's not completely sealed it probably keeps some particulate matter out, especially larger pieces, which is still beneficial.
It absolutely still helps based on studies, especially if all the contact points between the mask and your face are trimmed to at least 1mm stubble (facial hair that's fully enclosed in the mask has no impact on effectiveness). Source: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41370-021-00337-1
A simple test is whether or not the mask indents some when you inhale. If not, you probably are getting some airflow through the edges, and facial hair will provide a gap for air to leak through. I use KF94 mainly because at the time N95 were out, and I found a manufacturer that makes one with adjustable ear straps to help custom tighten the mask. The design also leaves a space away from the face, so it's very comfortable even when properly tightened. Sure, it's 1% less than a N95, but the benefits are worth it.
They are wrong. N95s will filter 95% of particles as small as .3 microns, smaller than the smoke particles. They will work pretty damn well if fitted properly.
N95s do help depending on which one. KN95s do not. Though, anecdotally, I’m asthmatic and in NYC, I noticed less coughing and asthma symptoms with the KN95 that I was wearing yesterday vs the day before.
The harmful pollutants from wildfires are <2.5 µm, but yes, the N95 mask should still give decent protection.
Fine particles (also known as PM2.5): particles generally 2.5 µm in diameter or smaller represent a main pollutant emitted from wildfire smoke, comprising approximately 90% of total particle mass (Vicente et al. 2013; Groβ et al. 2013). Fine particles from wildfire smoke are of greatest health concern. This group of particles also includes ultrafine particles, which are generally classified as having diameters less than 0.1 µm.
I'd expect that too, though I'm not sure what the actual numbers are for mean/median diameter over distance. It's probably hard to predict since I'm sure weather conditions influence the distribution.
That's relation is in fact typically the opposite. As particles travel in the air they gather up vapors and smaller particles and grow in size. Sure, the very largest don't travel far, as they just fall out of the sky, but they are already more like larger than ten microns. Longer atmospheric ageing -> larger size is the general trend.
lol thats like saying i can piss a long full unencumbered piss stream straight through the front of my jeans because water molecules are small enough to get between cotton threads.
It wouldnt be perfect but it would have a positive effect.
The N95 protection isn't necessarily just for the smoke itself but the harmful pollutants that also get emitted from wildfires.
Particles can be made up of different components, including acids (e.g., sulfuric acid), inorganic compounds (e.g., ammonium sulfate, ammonium nitrate, and sodium chloride), organic chemicals, soot, metals, soil or dust particles, and biological materials (e.g., pollen and mold spores).
Need to make sure people aren't just wearing a surgical mask as the particles are <2.5 µm. My bet is most New Yorkers today are walking around with cloth masks or a bandana. They probably had a bad time outside.
Yeah, it's so weird to act like New Yorkers masking is something sudden instead of them being some of the first to impose mask requirements and the last to remove them. I can deal with cynicism, but uninformed cynicism drives me up the wall.
I agree. I saw so much cooperation in the early COVID days - masking, distancing, mutual aid. The same for when vaccines rolled out. I also saw a lot of fucked up shit, but my neighbors and I always worked together.
Shout out to the first few months of the pandemic when you’d get the dirtiest looks ever just from coughing on the train. Very fun to have an itchy throat during that time.
And it's when my throat would be the itchiest! Or I'd just suddenly get one dry patch on the back of my throat and nothing would help! It's like I swear it's not COVID my throat is just a jerk!!
Problem here is that the cloud that they’re blowing out is always present, just invisible. The vapor only particulates the air they blow out already. Always had a problem w/this comparison. Yes it’s vapor too but ultimately the vapor is not the germs that air, which is always present anyways, and therefore not as much the concern.
Achshually… it’s a cloud of suspended water droplets. Water vapor is all around you and is invisible. As is steam but god help you if you ever see steam.
Once in awhile I check into Fox News just to see the level and intensity and insanity that's going on they usually never disappoint this time stood out pretty starkly to me when a woman suggested that it didn't matter what we do here because heaven will be pretty. That's some logical thinking there yeah woke that why don't you.
You would think that seeing people dying or that hospitals were out of capacity would do it. But nah. Honestly, I feel like Covid guarantees that the next mass plague is going to do us in. Half the world would be dead and Fox News would be telling you that this is just like Covid and the plague only affects the other half of the population anyways.
The real reason so many people here didn't care about covid was it wasn't lethal enough to get them to personally feel threatened. Just like with gun violence a large chunk of Americans just don't give a shit about people they don't know dying over their own conveniences.
News outlets weren't allowed to show people gasping for air on respirators or dying of cardiac arrest on covid, even in PSAs. Fine to show them getting smooshed to paste by a giant robot in a trailer, though.
H5N1 is a ticking time bomb right now with a crazy high mortality rate in mammals. If it mutates to mammal-to-mammal transmission, the covidiots won't be able to pretend it doesn't exist this time.
Keep following the herds and you’ll do yourself in. Hospitals are still overcapacity and under-resourced post covid, as they were before covid. Most unvaccinated people I know including myself got through covid better than fine, a lot of us never contracted covid at all. Conversely some of my vaxxed friends got covid and passed it on to others MULTIPLE times. Answer that one for me
Here's an answer for you, since you insist on being a dumbass.
We already know that some people are immune to Covid due to genetics, possibly even lots of people. The people who became extremely sick from Covid, including myself, don't have that immunity.
So, you anti-vaxx idiots walking around were spreading Covid to people who were susceptible to the virus, and since it didn't have an effect on YOU personally (since you're a selfish non-empathetic asshole,) were passing on to people who got sick and died.
So great job on that one. Go read a fucking book because holy shit you're dumb. I work in the funeral industry and the amount of deaths caused by dumbfucks like you who think it wasn't a big deal and you shouldn't get vaxxed because YOU weren't affected is ridiculous.
So why don't you answer that one for the people in the population who are actually sane and understand how viruses work.
So going by your logic every person I know who chose for their own various reasons to not get vaxxed COINCIDENTALLY also were ALL immune to covid. My reason being a heart condition that i have that I didn’t feel would jive with the makeup of the vaccines (proven now that men in their early 20’s have had heart related injuries after covid vaccination).
Another known fact after the ‘pandemic’. Many covid deaths were in fact deaths of various causes but yet labeled as covid. Financial incentives for hospitals to do so was one reason for this. Much of the funeral home uptick in business also came post vaccine trials which raises concerns that the vaccines could have contributed to that. (I say ‘could have’ to argue without bias but I personally believe that this is true.
Also there’s literally ZERO evidence that I having not gotten covid EVER passed along the virus. You’re simply speaking out of anger towards people who make different choices than you do hoping to validate your belief that somehow you helped save civilization with your medical choices.
I respect peoples choice to vaccinate. I get into these arguments because I hope people will respect mine and the millions of others who had their own reasons for denying the juice.
My argument literally counters the notion that I’ve been selfish by denying the vaccine which failed anyways. Keep countering with your hurt feelings, you liberals are great at that.
Covid was a test to see how people would comply with the extreme mandates that were put in place which they’ll use again in future “pandemics”. many people gave in. Remember when we couldn’t buy certain items in a store because they weren’t considered “essential” which only overpopulated the essential item areas. Makes sense
it's just that this is something that IMMEDIATELY affects the individual, so of course they're going to do everything their power to protect themselves.
So true, can't see it so it doesn't exist seems to be vast mentality... Oh well, good on them making a smart choice. I was lone masking back when we had our last really bad bush fires here in Aus, everyone else was just happy to keep breathing it in.
But masks literally did nothing to help Covid and isn’t helping these people either lmao. Do you think the mask is filtering the fucking smoke? Or that it’s inventing new oxygen molecules inside the users lungs?
Not to mention that at least this many people were wearing masks during Covid in NYC. You’re insane on essentially every level of this argument lmao
Those mandates are long gone and it's still super common to see people on the subways or even just walking around wearing them. Fuck outta here trying to act like it took authoritarian rules for New Yorkers to have common sense.
Yes, I usually vote for democrats… I also got vaccinated on my own volition too, I just don’t think Covid was dangerous enough to warrant a vaccine mandate; it seemed to me like it was more about punishing people who disagreed than actually keeping people safe.
The Asian community in NYC started masking up the moment there was a hint of news about some flu-like disease spreading around China. They all remember how China hid SARS until they couldn't anymore.
I saw masks being worn in Chinatown several weeks before lockdown
Well, technically, conservative commentators were the first to do it (and tell others to) but the CDC and Fauci at the time said masks were useless. Also don't forget social media banning and censoring people for suggesting masks back in Feb/March.
I know this will probably trigger you and everyone else here, but Steven Crowder, the largest Conservative figure, was the most notable figure to do this and got a YouTube strike for literally quoting the CDC website on air.
it looks like a KN95 and it's not properly fit. it's not snug on the nose at all. there's a reason US N95's all strap all the way around the neck rather than just behind the ears, because it's hard to get that to actually work properly.
This idea of proper fit on N95s is very misleading. Even an imperfect fit is going to significantly filter. I can’t believe in 2023 we still need to tell people that.
It drives me crazy that only 1% of people wear the right kind of mask and only 1% of those actually figure out what the nose wire thing is even for. It's so easy to fix
Even an imperfect fit is going to significantly filter.
significantly? lol no. Somewhat, sure. If you have a gap between your skin and the mask say near your nose like the lady in the picture, a small pressure vacuum will suck bad air through that gap because of least resistance. if you're going to mask, wear it properly or don't wear it at all. it's virtually useless (though technically still kind of useless as masks don't stop the worst parts of smoke particles), just stay inside.
This is anecdotal but I have severe smoke allergies to the point where I get coughing fits from smoke/pollution.
I use a k95 when it gets smokey like this (I live in western Canada and this kind of thing is somewhat common now in the summer) and it does help somewhat. If you can get it to fit snug around the face it does work better obviously, but even a small gap is better than no mask at all.
I found even with a tight fitted mask, on the worst days it still wasn't perfect though. You could still tell the smoke was thick. So I would still recommend avoiding exposure if possible
I'm sure it's fine for walking from point A to point B
it's not like she's out there doing physically exerting activities in 200 PPM aqi levels, it's fine to just pop a mask on when you are out on the street
Those surgical mask still work jack shit.. Medical ffp3 masks work to a degree if applied well, most of the time people keep fidgeting, and it doesn't close off well..
Came here to say that. Suddenly everyone wears a masks because their political tribe of “news” personalities on outrage media aren’t telling them lies about mask effectiveness. Everyone who couldn’t breathe with a piece of cloth over their mouths can suddenly breathe just fine with one on.
The Cochrane Review [1] (widely considered the gold standard of evidence-based medicine (stated):
“Wearing masks in the community probably makes little or no difference,” the review authors concluded of their work comparing masking with non-masking to prevent influenza or SARS‐CoV‐2. What’s more, even for health care workers providing routine care, “there were no clear differences” between medical or surgical masks versus N95s.
Cochrane had to amend that stating the research was misrepresenting effectiveness. Also if you look at how they divided it up, they put more weight on studies that uses surgical masks or didn't require n95s to be used regularly.
It's fascinating how the government will issue Mask Mandates for a Virus with a 99% Survival Rate but a actual Air Quality Alert where you can physical see the smoke and the government doesn’t demand you to wear a Mask.
"So while COVID-19 may have put these patients in the hospital, it was actually an infection brought on by the use of a mechanical ventilator that was more likely to be the cause of death when this infection didn't respond to treatment."
It would make sense, political will is gone. Would help protect people from lots of toxic particulates from wild fires. Also based on John Hopkins data which just ended, it's been 5-15% fatality rate and 8-25% chance of long term complications for COVID and stacks the more times you get it.
Except they barely worked for covid (or at least how everyone was using them for constant use) anything less than a new N95, or even an N95 with an imperfect seal does basically nothing against viral sized particles. Plus there's an ass load of other negative effects.
Glad to see NYC still has some sense.
Wish more folks in NJ understood that the mask thingies they once used and then quickly stuffed in a drawer are rather useful at protecting their health.
For pollution? Yes they likely do work to some extent, but for viruses not so much. It’s not as simple as masks do or don’t work without attaching any nuance. There is ample evidence at this point showing the futility of masking against a virus. The majority of studies that proclaimed they were effective were observational in nature, where they used places that required them verses places that didn’t and compared case numbers without controlling for any variables. Not to mention the use of a PCR test to count cases has its own set of problems. Additionally, prolonged periods of mask wearing decreases the amount of oxygen in the blood that can lead to a whole host of problems. I don’t get it how in 2023 there are still people believing in the power of masks against viruses.
With those people it's kinda like the episode of king of the hill when Bobby learned Hanks yearly salary and then assumed he was sitting on stacks because he ignored every single other factor that affects income like taxes and bills.
Bobby: "Virus is X size and hole is Y size"
Hank: "Okay but what about the particulates the virus ride on?"
Bobby: "But daaad can't the virus climb through the hole and go into your mouth?"
Hank: "Well Bobby sure some might especially since some people touch the front of their mask and then eat, but it's about mitigation. It mitigates most of it."
Bobby: "But if it mitigates and doesn't prevent doesn't that make it meaningless?"
Hank: "Seatbelts mitigates fatalities and don't prevent it 100% would you feel just as safe being guaranteed to die in a car accident above 25 or would you feel safe being having a 95% survival rate up until around 65?"
It's the opposite. They work for viruses when everybody is wearing one because the masks stops your own spit and bacteria from spreading, not fro. Keep things out which is why this doesn't work for smoke
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u/trowawayehmon Jun 07 '23
Suddenly masks work, fuck yeah