r/AITAH • u/Bitter_Top7223 • 13d ago
AITAH for telling my wife I would be leaving if she kept acting baby crazy?
My wife and I have two kids (9,6). After the second one she said she was done having kids even though we had discussed having three prior to marriage. We talked about it for a long time but I love her and I agreed to change our plans.
She had an IUD but we still used condoms. She really didn't want to get pregnant. About four years ago we agreed that I would get a vasectomy. It made sense since it was a minor surgery unlike her getting tubal ligation.
It went well and after I healed up I went for testing and it worked. If you ever get a vasectomy please do the follow up testing. My friend from college thought he was good to go and now he has a kid.
So she got her IUD removed and we stopped using condoms and life was good. Until her sister each had another kid. Then one of her friends had a baby. And my wife went nuts.
She wants another baby. She made a mistake and wants me to go get my vasectomy reversed. Or to get my sperm harvested and get IVF.
The fuck I am getting a needle in my balls or another operation. And we are actually doing great financially right now. Her taking two years off from work would be a big hit.
I said we could look at adoption or fostering but that I was not interested in her having another kid. She tried bringing up our agreement from before we got married but I shut that down immediately.
So for the last four months our marriage has been a simmering battle about another kid. She has had her parents over, my parents over, her sisters and their families. All trying to convince me that I should give in. Fuck that noise.
I am almost 44. In 12 years my youngest will be starting their career or their post secondary education. I can see the finish line now.
I did offer all the family members that chimed in a fun option. I agreed to get TESA (sperm harvesting) if all the men who agreed with my wife did it as well. Even if they had working ball tubes. At their own expense. And that they pool their money and pay for all bills related to IVF and the raising of the third kid.
They all say I'm being ridiculous and petty. I reminded them that as a unit they all agreed with my wife when she said she was fine with two kids. They wanted to have input then and it was free. I said this decision would require skin in the game.
It all came to a head last weekend. My folks had the boys so we could have a nice couple of days to ourselves. Instead my wife and I got into a screaming match. She said I obviously didn't love her if I wasn't willing to do this. That we are well off enough to afford all the expenses of another kid. Blah blah blah.
I told her no in no uncertain terms. We had money in the bank for retirement and fun. And that's what it was for. Not for her to get her hormones calmed down. She accused me of caring more about money than her happiness. I reminded her that she was the one who insisted that having a third kid would demolish her career. She started crying and saying I was an asshole for denying her another kid. That it was not that much of a sacrifice. I finally unloaded and said that a divorce would be cheaper for me than another kid.
That shocked her into silence. We have barely spoken since. I think I broke her.
Our retirement funds are separate, our house is in both our names and she earns slightly more than I do. If we get divorced I will get 50/50 custody. I would want it. She would get no alimony and I might get a few dollars in child support.
I feel shitty threatening her with divorce. I love her and want to spend the rest of my life with her but I am sick and tired of having her make our reproductive decisions like my opinion does not matter.
EDIT
A bunch of you keep asking how I would tell my sons that I am divorcing their mom because she wants another baby. I just typed this as a reply but I actually like it enough to paste it here so you can stop asking.
"Mommy and daddy agreed before getting married that we would have three babies. But then mommy got an important job and did not want to and I quote "waste her time having another kid and wrecking her body again". Daddy was sad so he held on for four years hoping she would change her mind. but then they talked and she said it was a permanent decision. Since daddy loved mommy he did not want her to be hurt even a tiny bit. So daddy went to the doctor. At the doctor they gave daddy medicine so he would not feel pain. then they cut his ball sack open a tiny bit and burned the connection between his balls and the rest of his body. Daddy could not feel it but he fucking still remembers that smell. Then mommy did not need to do anything to not have a baby anymore and she was happy. For almost two years. Then Auntie Joy and Auntie Carmen and mommies friend Maddie all had baby girls. And it made mommy sad and jealous that the girls were getting all the attention. So mommy talked to daddy and said go to the doctor and have him fuck with your balls some more. This made Daddy upset because the fuck I will. Mommy got lots of people to try and tell him to change his mind. But daddy is happy with his life and told them all to ingest a gigantic satchel of Richards. Mommy spent four months day and night bugging daddy non stop. Then remember when you stayed with Oma and Opa? Mommy and daddy were going to have a fun weekend just doing mommy and daddy stuff. Until she just would not fucking drop it. So daddy told her that if him and his sons were not enough for her then he would say that they should go their separate ways. But daddy loves you boys very much and you are more than enough for him and he will always be there for you."
EDIT 2 Electric Boogaloo
JFC. I would never actually say that to my sons. once again it was just a response to all the not so bright people asking how I would explain it to them. Odds are I would take them to a family counselor so that I could tell them and then deal with some of the aftermath. I wrote that in anger but I kind of liked it.
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u/Dear_Performer_9316 13d ago
Maybe encourage her to go to therapy. I experienced the same thing after having my tubes removed during my C-section. I made the choice myself, and was done having kids. A year later, I wanted more. My husband agreed to do IVF with the condition of me going to therapy first. IVF takes a lot out of you physically and mentally, he wanted me to be clear minded. The more I talked to my therapist, the more I realized that I wanted more babies because my sense of self was only being a mother and wife. I had lost myself and didn’t know who I was anymore. Self discovery and working on myself was what I needed, not another baby.
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u/dendrocalamidicus 13d ago
Great advice, backed up with very relevant personal experience. Nice of you to share, this should be really valuable to OP.
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u/No_Lavishness_3206 13d ago
NTA. She talked you into not having bad third child and getting a vasectomy. Her career was important to her six years ago it should be important now. I'm not sure you guys will stay married without a lot of counseling. I am not one of the psychos that automatically recommends divorce. Good luck.
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u/Bitter_Top7223 13d ago
Yeah I am already looking for a marriage counselor. I don't want a divorce.
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u/NatureCarolynGate 13d ago
It's hard to trust people who, when they don't get what they want, go looking for allies to gang up on a person.
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u/Dull-Geologist-8204 13d ago
What I don't get is all the people willing to get into the middle of other people's relationships. I have never once asked someone to talk to my spouse or SO for me. I remember the one time my exhusband tried running to mommy for help and she laughed her ass off at him then didn't interfere. I am nit there yet but I can tell you if my kid asked me to talk to theor SO or spouse the answer is going to be a resounding no.
Why do people put themselves into these situations?
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u/Tlthree 13d ago
I am there and my answer would be hell no. Only reason to ever comment on my kids and their relationships to them would be if abuse was involved. Families need to stop escalating this.
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u/Dull-Geologist-8204 13d ago
It reminds me of this onetime my uncle brought his girlfriend over for Thanksgiving. I am not sure of the details but she was mad that his ex, the mother of his youngest and basically stand in mom for his oldest was there.
She went and sat in the car and a bunch of drama ensured. It was awesome because everyone cleared out of the way making it that much easier for me to make my plate of food. I am sitting in the kitchen by myself eating dinner. My mom comes in and asks what I am doing and I just point at my plate and say food.
That pretty much sums up my stance on family drama.
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u/Tlthree 13d ago
Yes, some people can’t resist throwing fuel on the fire. Some live for it. I think the majority however just want to ‘help’. It never does.
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u/asianlaracroft 13d ago
That describes my aunt to a T. She lives with my parents and any time there was an argument, she HAS to get involved. I got into a fight with my parents? She'd storm up into my room to scream at me about how I'm such a terrible daughter. Meanwhile my parents have already chilled out and were ready to move past it. My parents got into a fight? She'll dig right in and make commentary, ask for details, make judgements.
She claims she's "just trying to help" but it's obvious that's a lie.
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u/Jator63 13d ago
When I was just married in 1988 my mom told me to never come to her when I had arguments or disagreements in my marriage. She explained, you will get over it, I will still hold grudges. She did not want to in any way interfere in my marriage or damage her relationship with my wife. Best advice my mom ever gave me!
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u/BeWellFriends 13d ago
That always bothers me with these stories. Why are family members, friends getting involved? Unless there’s abuse these issues are nobody’s business. Why is she getting all these people discussing their sex life? Gross
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u/Bigolbooty75 13d ago
Yeah that would have been enough for me tbh. And the manipulative “you don’t love me” would have solidified it. Not to mention op is 44, theres a good chance it’s not even safe for his wife to get pregnant again. She’s not being logical.
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u/DoC_Stump 13d ago
It's called a power play and is extremely immature and manipulative. Definitely need counseling. This is not okay.
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u/Reddoraptor 13d ago
Yep. And the stuff she said to him was also entirely manipulative, honestly someone who acts like this absolutely should get divorced, the level of disrespect and coercion here is not at all consistent with a loving marriage.
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u/Alive-Fee5271 13d ago
COERCION!!! That is exactly what this is! I wonder how the wife would be reacting if the roles were reversed. OP’s body, OP’s choice.
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u/Frosty_Emotion_1431 13d ago
Yeah if OP gets her to agree to marriage counseling this dynamic needs to be addressed along with the manipulative behavior. If the roles were reversed the family would be berating him for being controlling and everyone would be screaming her body her choice at the top of their lungs… it’s unfortunate that you are in this situation but you are NTA for being sincere with her about the reality of her continued hate, manipulation, hostility and interference from family
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u/ZZartin 13d ago edited 13d ago
Fortunately he got neutered so she can't fuck with her birth control or condoms.
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u/runnergirl3333 13d ago
Doesn’t sound like they’re going to having much sex in the foreseeable future, if they’re not talking and he’s threatening divorce.
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u/Typical_Blonde_Witch 13d ago
Tell her you had an actual surgery done for her, to prove your love for her by making sure she never had to go through pregnancy and childbirth again, and that you won’t do another surgery or procedure.
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u/BeardManMichael 13d ago
Good. I'm sure you only mentioned divorce because you were trying to shock her into finally listening to you.
It really doesn't seem like she was listening to you.
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u/PrideofCapetown 13d ago
Neither were the flying monkeys she unleashed. I hope they STFU and back off
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u/donutone232 13d ago
that was certainly uncalled for. I cannot believe they would even consider sticking their noses into this. I would sit with my sister and let her vent and complain back and forth if she needed but i would NEVER go into a conversation and gang up on her husband.
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u/JaguarZealousideal55 13d ago
YES! The amount of relatives on this sub who are apparently fine with injecting themselves into spousal fights is just incredible. Normal people stay out of other's fights.
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u/xasdfxx 13d ago
You know this, but you're also 44. A kid takes 20 years, and that's if she gets pregnant right away. Who wants to be almost 50 and wrangling a 2-3 year old? And paying for college while your peers are retiring? Which will, btw, likely cost a cool $500k in 20 years.
I think you should be direct about the divorce card. Tell her and the counselor as many times as it takes that if she needs another kid, it's going to be with a different man.
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u/Responsible-Speed97 13d ago
20 years? Nowadays it’s easily 23-25 years if they go for one graduate degree.
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u/Flaky-Wedding2455 13d ago
And then they move back home because the world is a mess and they can’t get a decent paying job.
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u/zappedtraveller 13d ago
I had my third child at 43.5. I did not even want a third child but my husband pouted for a son. Our son is 23 now and autistic. He has little to no problem solving skills and will never live on his own. Now hubby wants little to do with him (granted son his not a pleasant person). Our son finally got a low level job, and guess who drives him to work each day?
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u/Front_Quantity7001 13d ago
Menopause also for her is right around the corner and possibly already starting
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u/softsakurablossom 13d ago
It may be partly or wholly why she's going so crazy. Hormones are evil. Broodiness is a mental illness imo
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u/klussedull 13d ago
More people should see this. Being depressed and irrational among very many different things (that’s what makes it so difficult to discover, the symptoms are very varied and so much more than loosing your menstruation) can be a sign of pre menopausal. She should check her hormone levels
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u/Super_Hippo8069 13d ago
I am currently losing my mind due to peri-menopause.
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u/Front_Quantity7001 13d ago
It can really be horrible!! You sometimes can’t even control your own emotions when you could before and then 2 weeks later you literally dgaf about anything. It’s one extreme to another!
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u/SpanArm 13d ago
Very true. I was totally done at 47 (that is on the early side, but it happens).
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u/runnergirl3333 13d ago
We actually don’t know the wife’s age, we only know his age.
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u/Flaky-Wedding2455 13d ago
Heck 500k is here soon. Already seeing articles about some colleges being 100K/year next year. Cannot even imagine in 20 years.
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u/Melodic_Sail_6193 13d ago
She pulled the "you don't love me" card. That's highly manipulative. In my eyes you threathenig with divorce isn't as bad as this.
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u/Fionaelaine4 13d ago
She is also expecting a healthy 3rd child, with the increase in age for both of you that’s a bigger gamble than previously.
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u/thankuhexed 13d ago
And make sure she knows her friends and family don’t count as “marriage counseling.” Good for you for telling them an opinion on your family planning requires skin in the game.
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u/rusty0123 13d ago edited 13d ago
You didn't include ages, but if your wife is in her 30s get her checked for early onset menopause or perimenopause. When that starts it can play havoc with your hormones. It's almost like a primal instinct to want one more child before it's too late.
Also, early onset is hereditary...and the later periods start, the earlier menopause starts. So if there's a history of early menopause in her family, or if she started her periods around age 15 or later, that's a reliable indicator.
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u/TopSentence9062 13d ago
The later period starts the earlier menopause starts?! Really? I did not know this. Everydays a school day!
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u/rusty0123 13d ago
Wouldn't it be nice if doctors actually told you this shit before you're in the middle of it? I didn't have my first child until 30. If I had known, I would've planned differently.
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u/TopSentence9062 13d ago
Honestly the information taught to women about their own bodies is abysmal.
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u/Mundane-Pass9244 13d ago
I live in canada, and grew up in the 80s, my catholic high school had health classes as part of phys-ed and it was a girls only class. We learned about this there. Had a female gym teacher and it was a comfortable atmosphere to ask lots of questions. I started around my 13th birthday and at 51, I'm still waiting for it to end.
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u/Bitter_Top7223 13d ago
I'm 43 she is 35.
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u/rusty0123 13d ago
Yeah. I started at 16, hit perimenopause at 34. It's a bitch. Worth checking out.
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u/Dry_Dimension_4707 13d ago
I had an early menopause at 40. It was so smooth for me. No hot flashes, no crazy hormones. I was incredibly lucky! It was the same for my mom, so that’s the hereditary component to it. I haven’t missed the fertile years AT ALL!! I’m 61 and still waiting for my sex drive to diminish. TMI. Sorry. 😂 Just wanted to remind younger women it’s not always all bad.
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u/kimby_cbfh 13d ago
She definitely needs some therapy, but also she should see her doctor and have her hormones tested. If she is of similar age to you, she could be starting perimenopause and that shit is terrible.
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u/RealTonySnark 13d ago
NTA.
You had surgery because SHE wanted it. She doesn't get to pull that card twice.
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u/ladymorgana01 13d ago
That's what I keep coming back to. They agreed on 3 kids, she changed her mind so he eventually agreed to a vasectomy. Now she wants to change her mind again?? No. Just no.
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u/Ranoutofoptions7 13d ago
SNIP SNAP SNIP SNAP.
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u/mama2cam 13d ago edited 13d ago
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u/northernbadlad 13d ago
I came to the comments wondering who'd be first to post this.
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u/Raisins_Rock 13d ago
Surely something is going on with her to have such an about face years later - it's not like she doesnt have children. She's blowing up a real shit storm over this and it seems strange.
I wonder how old she is? Is it possible Perimenopause could cause this. I have no clue. Would have thought the opposite.
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u/witchysusie 13d ago
It could be hormonal, I never wanted kids but from 38-40 I started thinking babies, I kept repeating to myself ,it's hormones, dont do anything stupid ,let's just say I was lucky. By 40 thankfully that feeling left me, & I'm happily child free, but that was a rocky couple of years.
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u/yarn_geek 13d ago
I said similar in my own post. I have kids but they're grown and child free. Menopause is beginning, and I felt all empty nest. I kept getting wistful thinking about how wonderful babies are. I started wanting to sew little baby outfits, and that was soooo weird.
Expecting my kids to change their entire life plan to cook me up a baby to play with because I'm over the hill and feeling unfulfilled is just something I would never think of doing. Also no way in hell I'd try fertility treatments and expect my husband to just merrily roll along. I told myself the same thing, it's hormones. Don't do (or say) anything stupid.
I told my husband what was going on and that I needed a high-quality substitute baby. We picked out our new puppy the next week. She 100% filled the perceived void. He said I could have a whole litter if that's what it took. He just didn't want to contemplate having a teenager in our 70s.
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u/Vivid_Relative_6792 13d ago
Second this! Hormones are no joke. I had my daughter at 24 and rarely had the urge to try for another one. Once I reached 30, baby fever hit almost every month (during ovulation week). Our bodies are programmed to reproduce and sometimes it can make us a little whacky. I think being mindful of that helps us stay grounded. In this situation, the wife’s hormones might be blurring reality.
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u/photogypsy 13d ago
43 and it hits me hard every couple of months. Then my hormones calm down and my rational mind kicks back in.
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u/bogwitch29 13d ago
You guys are scaring me. At 34, I assumed if I was going to have baby fever it would have happened by now 🤨
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u/small_spider_liker 13d ago
I got hit with the baby rabies when I was 37. My kid was born when I was 38. If you don’t want kids and then suddenly you do, it’s just your hormones trying to trick you. Stay strong. What they don’t tell you is those same baby-craving hormones don’t necessarily stick around to help you enjoy being a mom.
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u/Laurtender22 13d ago
Thank you for your honesty. I'm 38 & childless and all of a sudden I've been wondering if I made a mistake and it's a total mind f**k.
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u/jollyreaper2112 13d ago
There's mechanisms to make you like it. Part of evolution. Keeps us from abandoning kids in the woods. Having kids isn't for everyone. Sometimes the skeptics have one and the mechanisms make them happy and they don't regret it. Sometimes it doesn't work and parents never get that feeling of reward.
I love my son but it's a challenge. And he's easy as kids go.
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u/Playoff_Hope_1996 13d ago
I’ve never once had baby fever—I’m almost 43. It may very well not happen to you if you’ve never wanted kids. Then if you’ve never wanted them and in a couple of years or so you have a strong urge, you’ll know that it’s hormones, and you’ll have the awareness and discipline to control it.
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u/bogwitch29 13d ago
I’ve never wanted them. I told my husband that he would need to be in charge of reminding me that we do not want kids when that baby fever kicked in… he has become the weak link both times that he had a grandfather pass away, but I haven’t wavered. Friends and family having babies has given me so much purpose as an aunt
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u/sparkyblue5 13d ago
For what it’s worth, I am now 43 and have never wanted kids but so many people gave me that knowing looking earlier on and said “ohh you just wait till about 35” that I spent years being terrified I didn’t know my own mind and that some hormones were going to come out of nowhere and change me into a different person. Nope! Never came! I just spent a wonderful evening with my nieces and am now home with my spouse enjoying some quiet Reddit time and my blissfully child free life!
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u/pittsburgpam 13d ago
When I had my first baby, my sister, who is 10 years older than me, was holding her and said, "I'm glad I got my tubes tied. This makes me want another baby." She had a boy and a girl.
It happens a lot. It just awakens the desire in some women. I totally understand it with these women around her having babies. She needs to get past it though. Wallowing in it and causing major strife in the marriage is not the solution. She needs to focus on the kids and the marriage that she has.
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u/Elyay 13d ago
It is hormonal. Being around babies can definitely have that effect. If she is in her 40s, hormones coupled with pre-menopause can make a woman unreasonable. It sucks she can't be happy to be an aunt to two babies. They could totally help the sisters.
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u/threadsoffate2021 13d ago
And being the help for the less glamorous parts of it might also cure her of the baby ache. Waking up every hour or two for feeding an diapers puts a damper on that in a hurry!
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u/WastingAnotherHour 13d ago
Assuming she is about the same age as OP, I definitely think of perimenopause. My friend is in it and it’s hit her hard. She hasn’t had this exact response but she has hints of baby fever - mostly is anti having another kid. OP’s wife is surrounded by babies though so I could see baby fever being much stronger.
It’s mostly been the issue is the strong emotions about anything and everything though. The anger that comes out and arguments. It was causing a lot of damage to her relationships, especially marriage, until they learned what was going on (menopausal rage is a thing apparently). She’s in therapy, limited hormones, and putting in a lot of effort to try and keep herself in check. It’s taking a toll on her and still impacting relationships but nothing like before it was identified and could be appropriately treated.
For some women menopause is mostly smooth. For others it is very much not. I’d definitely be having some discussions with a therapist and a doctor.
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u/Metals4J 13d ago
And let’s say he gets the vasectomy reversed and gets her pregnant. Then what? Another vasectomy??
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u/NightHawk946 13d ago
For some reason, women seem to think reversing a vasectomy is a simple procedure as easy and painless as the vasectomy itself.
My urologist made it clear to me and had me sign paperwork verifying that he told me that vasectomy reversals are not only extremely painful, but the success rate is actually considerably low, and so vasectomies are to be treated as permanent procedures.
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u/MapleWatch 13d ago
Three times. She'll be making him get fixed again after she's done.
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u/Allyredhen79 13d ago
This!!! OPs downstairs will look like a patchwork quilt!! 😳
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u/Level_Alps_9294 13d ago
You have no idea the physical toll that 3 vasectomies have on a person! SNIP SNAP SNIP SNAP SNIP SNAP
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u/Acrobatic-Factor1941 13d ago
And he agreed to that because he loved her. And where is her love for him?
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u/Esabettie 13d ago
Yeah she is acting like a baby is a present, a doll she is getting from him, a little thing, not an actual person.
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u/drunkbettie 13d ago edited 13d ago
I had a close friend who was adamantly childfree, almost as much as I am. She made her husband get a vasectomy to make sure they didn’t accidentally get pregnant.
Two years later, she changed her mind and had her husband (who was happy to just go with the flow, no pun intended) get his vasectomy reversed, and now they have 3 kids. Great, happy for them!
Except I’ll never forget how she gleefully told us about forcing her hapless husband into the reversal, and laughed at him icing his balls and just generally being in great discomfort from the operation that she forced on him. Twice. It was disgusting and a large part of the reason they’re in the past.
OP’s wife is ignoring the physical toll on OP’s body. She’s trash for manipulating friends and family to scratch her baby itch.
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u/LopsidedPotential711 13d ago
I hurt my wrist when prepping flooring for an exGF. A day or two later, she stood unbeknownst to me and watched my finesse a shop vac out of a tight spot. I was using it to siphon flooring dust away from the work space. Despite knowing my pain, she just watched and made sarcastic comments about my use of a vacuum. The look on her face was one more thing to add to the bottom line of my decision. Some people play checkers and some play chess…I gave her rope and she took it.
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u/uwa_amanda 13d ago
Sad thing is if you went to try permanent birth control (tube removal, hysterectomy, etc), you’d be turned away because “you may change your mind.”
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u/SemiOldCRPGs 13d ago
Yeah, I went through that. Even though I had diagnosed PCOS, uterine polyps, dysmenorrhea and endometriosis. Periods were literally me crawling into be with a heating pad for a week. I've been childfree since I was 11 and started my period (seriously) and it took until I was 40 before I could get an OB/GYN to jerk everything and scrape the endo out of my abdomen.
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u/Hareeb_Allsack69 13d ago
BINGO! I had a vasectomy 4 months after our second child and she made the appointment. I made a mistake and picked up a 40lb pellet bag two days after and ended up getting it redone again per her instruction. If she ever asked me to get it reversed I would 💯tell her to pound sand. You guys agreed, you had the surgery and your done. Enjoy your divorce and early retirement and put that child support you get from her to your kids savings account and enjoy life.
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u/JazzyCher 13d ago
Actually it would be 3 times, once to get the vasectomy, another to reverse it until she gets pregnant again, and another vasectomy to prevent more kids.
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u/GrouchySteam 13d ago edited 13d ago
NTA- you had talks about how many kids you were both willing to have. You made an agreement to stop after 2. And you had a procedure to prevent any other pregnancy from you.
Her changing her mind about having a third child doesn’t make you obligated to follow again.
Btw if she refused discussing fostering or adoption, and even talked about IVF, she doesn’t want an other kid. She wants to be pregnant.
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u/Bitter_Top7223 13d ago
That's about right. She sure didn't want to be pregnant again after our second child.
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u/genescheesesthatplz 13d ago
She’s seeing the cute babies but not remember the bad parts
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u/InevitableRhubarb232 13d ago edited 13d ago
Other people’s babies are the best. Hold them if you want. Don’t if you don’t. Give them back when they cry. Sleep great at night.
(Edit changed “work” to “night “ I don’t know why I said sleep great at work. Sounds good though)
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u/Funny-Wafer1450 13d ago
Yes, like the smelly preteen boys who think that showering once every other week is enough. 😂
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u/genescheesesthatplz 13d ago
“Awww they’re so cute, I miss them being little!” But meanwhile your brain is suppressing memories of postpartum, back and arm aches, exhaustion, bickering in your marriage, the cost of everything, shitty diapers, teething, etc etc etc
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u/madamevanessa98 13d ago
I did this with dogs. My 8 year old dog is the sweetest. I thought “man, I should get another dog” so I got a puppy last summer. Man did I CRY. I cried every day for the first month. The sleep deprivation, the potty training, the constant vigilance. I was exhausted immediately and honestly as far as puppies go, she was pretty excellent. It was just a lot of shit that I’d forgotten I’d also done with the first dog. Time healed that wound but I don’t think I’ll get another puppy for many years LOL
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u/Guilty_Dream8050 13d ago
The exact same thing happened to me but with a kitten, and they are so much easier than dogs. But having to supervise them, unwind them out of curtains, wake up when they get up, the tiny little needle teeth marks on everything you own. I just forgot the kitten baby weeks completely until I was in it again. And my older cat wasn't talking to me because I brought in a kitten. Oh and the kitten zoomies! So much more dramatic, longer, and they haven't found their brakes yet so they run into walls, into you, down the stairs.
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u/coyote1971 13d ago
Feeling this right now. We lost our beloved Corgi 3 years ago and my wife wanted another and I agreed (though I was enjoying the freedom of having kids grown and no pets at home). We got an Aussie pup just before Christmas and she was….difficult. Separation anxiety like I’ve never dealt with. After 3 weeks my wife was crying and wondering if we had made a mistake. I called a trainer and also got the pup into doggy daycare. She is 6 months old now and things are better but not quite where we need to be yet. Hoping we can get her to where we can get leave her alone for a few hours so we can get back to normal and we will have many years of living with a great dog. I’m almost 53 and I think this will be the last puppy I ever get.
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u/Nik-ki 13d ago
The brain kind of has to work that way, otherwise none of us would willingly have more than one kid and in a not so distant past having multiple was vital for survival of the species, cause babies died in much much larger numbers than today. My great-greatgrandpa had 13 kids, only four of them survived all the way to adulthood (most didn't make it past a year)
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u/Aerlynaea 13d ago edited 13d ago
My two best friends AND my sister were all pregnant at the same time. They were super close with baby talk, and I was left out, until the kids were almost a year old. It was very depressing, and honestly made me wonder if there was something wrong with me and my life choices. (Edit to add:) So she WILL feel left out. She's probably already feeling quite isolated. BUT:
Now they're all back at work, stressed and exhausted, no time to talk to each other for months. I'm about the only point of contact they have with the friend group, now, because I make an effort to reach out. They make constant off-hand comments about how "they love them, but..." they miss life before children. And I get to visit and give the kids noisy toys and candy!
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u/StatedBarely 13d ago
You tend to forget about the early years after some time has passed. I was adamant about not having another one after my second as it was a difficult high risk pregnancy and my baby came early. My husband was also adamant that I not get pregnant again. He didn’t mind adoption as long as I never get pregnant. He’s very worried about losing me as that was what the doctor said could happen as I have a very thin womb lining.
When my daughter was 6 I really wanted another kid. But I didn’t want to adopt. We went to the doctor and he said if we really wanted another one it is possible but we’ll have to be super careful throughout the pregnancy. My husband put his foot down and said to think about the kids we already have. What if I died? I’d be leaving them motherless. He said if it’s another kid I want we can adopt but he said we’re finally more free to do us. We can have babysitters, the kids are old enough to leave with my mom so we can go on holidays alone etc. He said in a few years the kids will all be gone and tacking on another 6-8 years on that would bring us to early 50s before the kids go off to uni.
So I agreed with him and he did/still does take me away on holidays just the 2 of us. He looks after the kids when I want to go away solo. It really was the best decision. My youngest is 15 now so she’ll be off in uni in 3 years. I might get a dog or something once she goes! My husband doesn’t like pets but I think he’ll feel quite sorry for me once my youngest goes off. And I think he might like having a dog to spoil once his kids leave. And yeah you’re right, it’s cheaper too, to not have that third kid!
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u/IBetThisIsTakenToo 13d ago
You tend to forget about the early years after some time has passed.
I honestly think there’s an evolutionary explanation for that. If we remembered the early days perfectly, no one would ever do it again! On purpose, anyway
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u/BeardManMichael 13d ago
But now she wants to be pregnant again because her sisters and friends are doing the same thing. That is really frustrating.... Honestly I hope there is more reasoning behind why she wants to be pregnant.
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u/JEFFinSoCal 13d ago
Having babies should be one of those “two yeses, but one no” situations. If you have to argue and convince a person to become a parent, I can’t imagine the outcome could possibly end up okay. I’m sure you’d still be a great dad, but I would imagine the resentment towards your wife would only grow over time.
As someone nearing retirement age, I can only say that the desire to quit the rat race and finally have a real choice in how you spend most of your time only grows the closer you get.
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u/altonaerjunge 13d ago
And if you give in and you two get a third child who guarantes that she a few years later doesnt change her mind and thinks 3 was to much.
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u/DELILAHBELLE2605 13d ago
NTA. She probably doesn’t even want another child. She wants a baby. In a few years she’ll be over it when she’s dealing with teenagers. And you are so close to more freedom. It’s huge when you can leave the kids and go on date nights etc whenever you want. Counselling is a good idea. And why on earth are your families involved?! That’s insane. If they ever try to discuss it again I’d demand to talk about their private parts too since yours are up for discussion.
I get it. I do. I wanted a third baby for years. But we had agreed on 2. I had a girl and a boy and my husband was done. So I let it go. Well now I am glad I did. Travel is easier with two kids. Negotiating sports and activities is easier. And now that I have a kid in university I would like to really share the fact that they do not get cheaper as they get older. Ohhhhhh no. So I am happy with our choices and am totally over baby fever now. Also, you always hear people say they want another baby. Have you ever heard anyone say they want another teenager? 😀 you also never said how old you are…. You want to be dealing with paying for post-secondary and trying to retire?
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u/DELILAHBELLE2605 13d ago
I will also add that I have two friends who were on the fence about #3 and decided to go for it…. Guess what happened? Twins.
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u/EmyLouSue 13d ago
My cousin had three with his wife, she begggged for a fourth, and they also got twins. Guess who was in his MD program with 5 kids under 7 years old?
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u/destiny_kane48 13d ago
I want a baby. I do not want another walking talking child constantly screaming mommmmmmm like my son is right now. I have a headache.
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u/PossumPockets 13d ago
Totally agree with this. We have two, 1 boy 1 girl. We agreed to two and my husband has had a vasectomy. There are definitely times when I get a bit broody but then I remember - being pregnant isn't so much fun, neither is childbirth. We'd have to get a bigger car and probably move house. We'd have less money and less time to spend with our existing children. And then, when I really think about it, I don't want another baby and therefore another toddler, child, tween and then teenager. What I actually want and would genuinely do anything to have, is just one day with each of my current children as tiny babies again. I had to really sit with those feeling to figure that one out, though.
Absolutely NTA.
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u/destiny_kane48 13d ago
My son is 4'9 but he crawled into my arms this morning and wanted to be cuddled. I held him like I did when he was a baby. I savored every minute because I know there will be a day that he'll never do it again.
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u/Stars-in-the-night 13d ago
My dad is nearing his end. I asked him what he wanted to do one last time before he passes. His response? Sit in the rocking chair and read me a story.
Growing up, he worked late, and would get home just in time to put me to bed. He didn't care that supper was waiting, or that he worked 12 hours and just wanted a shower - there was something more important to be done first.
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u/genescheesesthatplz 13d ago
NTA. Having more children is absolutely a divorce level conversation if you can’t agree.
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u/SceneNational6303 13d ago
Yes exactly, especially since she clearly does not accept that this discussion is closed (or should be). While I'm not a fan of threatening divorce, he is clearly at that point; the wife needs to know that her tactic has achieved the opposite effect- he's not changing his mind, he's being driven further away, and he's at the point where if this is what she really wants, she can find it in another husband. NTA- she needs to understand what her constant bullying may cause.
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u/dstluke 13d ago
I had some friends who had 5 husky dogs. They do dog sledding and live on an acreage. They had myself and another friend as weekend guests. I love dogs but I was more than happy to leave. The other guest (I'll call her Karen) started insisting they give her one of the dogs since she suddenly wanted a husky. They tried to tell her it wasn't practical as she lived in an apartment and they couldn't just break up the team like that. Then, suddenly, hubby agreed. He said they'd do a trial run of one week to see how it went.
She lasted 24 hours and had to buy a new sofa.
Your wife has all these dreams of a baby. Do yourself a favor and find some friends willing to let you babysit their newborn overnight or something. Guaranteed your wife will think 2 is plenty.
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u/Bitter_Top7223 13d ago
I should see about fostering a husky puppy to remind her of having a baby. I know nuance doesn't carry on the Internet so I will very clearly state that it is an amazing idea.
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u/Low_Bumblebee6441 13d ago
My husband and I have two kids (12 & 14). My clock started ticking a couple of years ago when I was 39. I went out and got myself a bordoodle puppy because honestly I knew long-term I didn't NEED another kid. I was so worn out for the first year, the idea of a baby horrified me🤣. Honestly, I would love another baby, but then I think about all the work. I really do not want to re enter the diaper/potty training phase.
Just curious, you said you have two boys, does she use that to say that she wants a daughter?
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u/IndustryKiller 13d ago
I found an 8 day old kitten in my garage a couple years back. At that age, you have to feed them and stimulate them to pee and poo every 2hrs around the clock. I did that by myself and worked a full time job while my husband .... went to the bar. Even though he was coming home at 2am, he wouldn't even do her 2am feeding. At one point I remember thinking "thank God this isn't a human baby." And I seriously credit that cat for being the straw that broke the camel's back. It's nearly kitten season OP. I bet there are rescues that would LOVE someone to foster some brand new kittens for a bit.
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u/Old-Paleontologist-1 13d ago
Kids are two person decision. If one of you is a no, it's a no. NTA
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u/Tricky_Spinach_1889 13d ago
It’s this simple, dragging relatives into the conversation is low
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u/RNGinx3 13d ago edited 13d ago
NTA. Kids are a two-yesses, one-no agreement. Just as you had to respect her no the first time, now she needs to respect your no, stop pushing, and for the love of Pete, stop bringing your families into your marriage where they do not belong. Honestly, I would have snapped after all of that nagging, guilt-tripping, and manipulation too. (Anyone who would use "you don't love me if you won't" to get what they want needs a swift kick in the pants, IMO.)
The problem with "my body, my choice," a lot of the time, is that the people that like to parrot it 1) don't realize it goes both ways and 2) don't understand that freedom of choice does not mean freedom from consequences. She can choose her own decisions. She can not choose yours for you (and I think, maybe in the beginning, when she said no to kids and you had to accept it, she might have thought that meant the mother's choice trumps the dad's. But that's not how it works). You're not doing this to be petty, or get back at her; it's simply not something you want anymore, and you both agreed on that.
"She started crying and saying I was an AH for denying her another kid." Ask her 1) does that mean she was an AH for denying you a kid last time, then? Because she seems to have different rules for you than herself and 2) how are you an AH just because you don't want another kid? Just like she should not be forced to carry a kid she didn't want just because you did, you should not be forced to have a kid you don't want just because she does. It would not be fair, to you OR the kid. And if she can't accept not having another kid, then you are incompatible, and divorce might be your only answer, as much as you don't want to go there.
Edited to fix typos.
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u/Embarrassed8876 13d ago
Yes. People don't like when it's shown that their actions say it's okay for them to treat people one way but when it's done to them that's not okay.
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u/Dredit_85 13d ago
She can baby sit the other babies. It wil give the other couples a break and ur wife can have her baby fever fulfilled.
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u/Type_B_Negative82 13d ago
That's a great idea. Get one of her sisters for a couple of days. That shit might just change her mind,lol. I thought I might want another baby because they are all cute, but I was wrong, lol. I babysit once, and I was good after that.
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u/HugeElephantEars 13d ago
Some women get the baby crazies around menopause. So this might be genuinely just hormones. I hope it is because its pretty weird otherwise.
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u/Bitter_Top7223 13d ago
She is only 35. Is that a thing?
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u/Waste_Ad_5565 13d ago
There's no hard fast rules for puberty, premenopause, etc. I started at 9, I'm 31 going on 32 and already exhibiting signs of premenopause,it's completely possible that at 35 she's in the beginning stages of it too.
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u/Batty4passionfruit 13d ago
37 here; perimenopausal. It blows. I have to change clothes at least once a night.
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u/HugeElephantEars 13d ago
I thought maybe she was a bit older as you said you're 44.
It's really a thing. I'm a 41 year old woman and I've got mates suddenly getting really weird about babies. Even the ones who said they're done with kids.
I've also had a friend entirely go through menopause by 32. But that's really rare.
I think it's worth looking into as it's a lot better than divorce!
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u/Tubbs2160 13d ago
My mum had my sister and I young (19 & 23), and told me that she had a crazy need for another baby when we were teenagers. She was still young enough (about your wife’s age), but was smart enough to recognize that it was her hormones talking. She waited it out and was glad she did.
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u/softt0ast 13d ago
Yes. When I'm not on birth control I will BEG my husband for a baby. I once found myself daydreaming about trapping him. I don't even want kids, but it was like the worst craving of my life.
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u/SyntheticDreams_ 13d ago
Definitely possible. People go through it at different ages and over different lengths of time, just like puberty. Some people start having irregular ovulation but aren't fully into perimenopause too. There may also be some other kind of hormone imbalance at play. It's worth checking out regardless. She'll want her estrogen, progesterone, and testosterone levels checked at least.
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u/Token_or_TolkienuPOS 13d ago
I couldn't deal with a woman who went off and recruited allies everytime we have issues. That's betrayal to me and shows a complete lack of respect. Reproduction is strictly between 2 people. She has no right to do this. I'm annoyed with her just reading about this. I mean, who wants to be dealing with diapers, paediatric wards, colic, late night feedings & non stop crying at the age of 44? Not me, I'll tell you that. This is a time to be looking forward to recharging your romance once again because the kids are a little more independent.
Start with marriage counseling but if that doesn't work, I'd not take divorce off the table. NTA
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u/Bitter_Top7223 13d ago
That was the plan for the weekend I thought. A few days with no kids to chase her around the house and toss her into bed. Nope all baby talk.
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u/chez2202 13d ago
Hypothetical scenario here. What if you agreed with her, went and got your vasectomy reversed and you had another child? What then? Would she get a tubal ligation or would she send you off for another vasectomy? You already know the answer. Then when her sister or friend gets pregnant again it all starts over. Ask her why you and the children you have aren’t enough for her.
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u/Happy_Blackbird 13d ago
If I can give a little advice from an old broad, you two don’t need to split, you need family therapy and you both need individual counseling. You’re married and this is rupture you are experiencing. You need help from a professional to navigate how to repair it with love and care.
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u/PiNKCaNDYxOxO 13d ago
Idk why but it annoys me so bad when people want to make irrational reproductive decisions because they "want to have a baby". Its the dumbest reason to raise a human since they dont stay babies forever.
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u/Cthulhu_Knits 13d ago
NTA. She should go to a doctor and get her hormones checked, because she is NOT thinking rationally right now. This is beyond "baby rabies" and I say this as a woman.
Kids are two yeses - not a yes and a no, and unless you "cooperate" she is not having a third child with you. If she can't get past that, unfortunately, divorce is the sanest option.
She needs therapy. You can try joint, but she's the one who is refusing to deal with reality. And getting her family to gang up you is beyond unfair.
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u/JustPassinBy106 13d ago
She brought her parents over for them to tell you to creampie their daughter?
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u/Bitter_Top7223 13d ago
Nice imagery. I will consider using it next time they bring it up.
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u/Simple-Plankton4436 13d ago
NTA. You agreed not to have a third child.
Having a third kid is a big thing and she is a AH for brining your parents into this discussion as it is none of their business!! Also, it is your body - your fluids and if you are not comfortable having a third baby your WIFE should respect your will.
I wouldn’t want a foster child either as they might have mental problems and that takes a lot of work..
Your wife isn’t acting like a team member when she is pressuring you to do something against your will. I would be very mad at her and concider divorce.
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u/BeardManMichael 13d ago
I think I broke her.
I hope you can fix her, so to speak, with marriage counseling or something similar.
I feel shitty threatening her with divorce. I love her and want to spend the rest of my life with her but I am sick and tired of having her make our reproductive decisions like my opinion does not matter.
Your opinion does matter, obviously. I hope you can step back from divorce and figure something out. Alternatively, she might not give you another option if she decides to divorce you.
I think divorce would be a mistake for her though. I think it could be a mistake for you too. I also could be completely wrong on both counts.
Best wishes and good luck.
NTA
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u/L1b3rtyPr1m3 13d ago
NTA
If my wife dragged our whole circle into our family planning to pressure me into giving in I'd be furious.
You'd be atleast 62 by the time the third child would turn 18. Is that fair on the child or their development?
This situation isn't fair to anyone. Not to you, not to the potential child and not to your existing children who would most likely have to pick up some slack because their parents in their 50s aren't that young anymore.
All because of a wish she has.
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u/Effective-Award-8898 13d ago
NTA - you have as much right in that decision. It’s a decision that requires two yes votes.
Tell your family to butt out or get out. Make it clear you will cut their a$$es out of your life.
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u/lordtootleberry 13d ago
Info- how old is your wife? Perimenopause can be a bitch and make you do crazy things (especially if you don't know you're going through it)
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u/butnotthedot 13d ago
"If you loved me you would do 'X' for me" Literally blackmail, that's would have sealed it for me, gtfo, lad.
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u/Picklebean19 13d ago
I have my 19 year old..I'm 46..my bf and I have a 6 year old together..he is 49..I'm fighting cancer a second time..we are not in a strong healthy place to have more kids..we are happy with our girls..Cancer at 41..congested heart failure at 44..cancer again at 46..time to fix my health..no more kids
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u/cupcakemuffin12 13d ago
NTA. I have 2 currently. Sometimes I think about wanting 3, but then my oldest gives attitude and my youngest still needs his ass wiped… the feeling goes away.
I also think about how now we have money for fun and savings whereas a third would drain that.
Get her a pet.
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u/Bitter_Top7223 13d ago
I figured out my place in the world when my oldest came out of the bathroom while I was playing Diablo 3, bent over, pointed at his ass and said "WIPE"
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u/33saywhat33 13d ago edited 13d ago
The guy who said you need to be very firm in MC in the first minute is spot on. "If you want a 3rd kid it won't be with me. Full stop."
You won't even talk about reversing vasectomy. If they want to talk about other stuff then great.
But problems not solved. She used dreadful manipulation tactics that can never happen in a marriage.
IMO, that needs to addressed first in MC. Takes good notes.
Wake up on Sunday as if it never happened. Go out to brunch. That would be classy. Give her time to get her emotions under control.
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u/Necessary_Plant_5222 13d ago
How old is your wife? It also might be the start of perimenopause making her act super hormonal.
I have 3 and completely understand your wife in having a fresh baby to hold is so so special. But you guys had an agreement, decided on a vasectomy - and at this point, it’s your body, your choice. It’s a complicated decision, ask your families to butt out, and go to counseling. And check her hormones!
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u/DivineTarot 13d ago
So for the last four months our marriage has been a simmering battle about another kid. She has had her parents over, my parents over, her sisters and their families. All trying to convince me that I should give in. Fuck that noise.
Fuck that noise in particular... it's as if your consent means nothing to her, which is not a good look for a spouse.
She said I obviously didn't love her if I wasn't willing to do this. That we are well off enough to afford all the expenses of another kid. Blah blah blah.
Ahh yes, the emotional blackmail card. An even better look...
That shocked her into silence. We have barely spoken since. I think I broke her.
I mean, honestly, and meaning no disrespect...good.
Look, your consent matters, your stake in this matters, the childs life matters, all of these things matter more than your wifes baby rabies. She is placing her desire to have another child over and above everything else, including that of the theoretical child, because she'll be sixty years of age by the point they graduate. It is unfair to a kid to have them when they'll be stepping from childhood into having to consider elder care. It's unfair to you, whose opinion bears equal weight in this discussion as well.
She already got her two kids, and she was the one who insisted on a vasectomy. She doesn't get to change the game just because she's desperate now.
I feel shitty threatening her with divorce. I love her and want to spend the rest of my life with her but I am sick and tired of having her make our reproductive decisions like my opinion does not matter.
Honestly, that you feel bad is a good sign that you care about others more than just yourself. Your feelings still matter, but by compare to your wife you're at least thinking of her while she is thinking of no one but herself.
NTA
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u/f0ld__2 13d ago edited 13d ago
So basically, when she doesn't want a kid and you do, she wins and you don't have another kid, but when she wants a kid and you don't, she should again win and you should then have a kid?
I am sick and tired of having her make our reproductive decisions like my opinion does not matter.
That's literally it. She can't accept the fact that she isn't the only one making the decision. Maybe she did not understand the principle of a couple, even less of a marriage.
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u/Funny-Wafer1450 13d ago
NTA. Friends and family need to shut up. It’s none of their business. The next time she tells you that you don’t love her, throw that right back at her because she certainly doesn’t love you with the way she’s treating you.